Speaker 0
Into the wild, I'm going into the wild, I am. It's been a wild, freedom child since I left my roots back home. Into the wild I'm good. Into the wild I am. It's been a wild freedom child since I left my roots back home.
Speaker 1
Welcome to the Free Birth Society podcast. This is a radical space for women who are ready to celebrate their autonomous choices in birth, motherhood, and beyond. Together, we'll learn about wild birth through personal narrative, we'll explore the politics of birth, and we'll analyze everything that relates to our lives as women from a feminist perspective. Here's your host, Emilee Saldaya. It's
Speaker 0
been a wild freedom check since I've left my roots back home.
Speaker 2
Welcome, Joy. So happy to have you here.
Speaker 3
I'm happy to be here. Thank you, Emilee.
Speaker 2
So let's just start at the beginning. Who are you before you have these four beautiful children? What is your life like? How old are you when you become a mom? And just take us into this snapshot of who you are as you become a mom, with your first child.
Speaker 3
Okay. So I'm Joy. I'm originally from Bronx, New York. And I think before, me before mom was just like fitness crazy. I guess, like everybody else, just trying to find myself. You know? One thing I did, I was very into heavy into fitness, nutrition, health, and wellness, not so much on the maybe home remedy side of the of things, but that's who I was in the beginning. So I became a mom, I guess, you wanna say maybe a little later than in life because I I turned I became a mom at twenty nine twenty nine. Yeah. Twenty nine. I don't even know what else to say about that.
Speaker 2
So you get pregnant, and and why do you choose a medical midwife with your first like, why don't you go the hospital route? What's the
Speaker 3
So number one, I don't do hospitals. I think I look at hospitals as some place for sick people to be. If you're sick, if you're injured, I mean, to a point where you can't care for yourself, then you go to the hospital. And I just don't view birthing moms as being sick or injured or anything like that, needing medical attention. That's one. Two, there's been a long, and you're no strangers to this. I know you know this. Long history of abuse with my people in the medical world, and it's just like a I do not trust the medical Stay away. Threats. And I think the third answer for that would be I don't know if you've ever had a like, smelled something and it generates a memory. Like, it's so Of course. Generates a memory from years ago. So when I was younger, unfortunately, I lost my oldest brother, but I was very young, and a lot of the memories I have were visiting him in the hospital. So that scent is, like, so powerful. And I can remember going to see somebody in the hospital a little later in life and walking in and having to walk out because I couldn't make it. You know? I think there's a mixture of all of that. I mean, long story short, I just have a a big dis mistrust for them. I just don't. I just don't. So when I first got pregnant, I did have a gynecologist, and I went to just kinda verify it with her. And then when she found out I wasn't gonna take it further with her, because she's like, wait. What what are your plans for this birth? And I was like, wow. I contacted a midwife. Like, I just knew to go that route. And I think I saw previously years before when I wasn't even thinking about having children, I saw a documentary on TV, and it was beautiful mama who had they were documenting a home birth, and they showed her home birth. It just looked stunning. And I was like, that is the way I'm bringing my children into this world, and it just kinda, like, stuck with me. So when I did get pregnant and I found out and she's like she found out that I contacted a midwife. I had a consultation set up, and I just kinda knew that was the way I was going. Back then, I didn't know anything about unassisted, free birthing, anything like that. It was just like hospital or midwife. This is what I knew. She scolded me. She, like, got really upset with me, and she tried to tell me all the dangers of having a home birth and yada yada yada yada. But I'm, like, very stubborn and strong minded a lot of times. So I just basically looked at her and was like, salut. I looked at her, and I was like, okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I just kinda shook my head to everything and never went back. Yeah. And it's funny because my mom has the same gynecologist, so she kinda had to tell her about the successes of what happened, you know, my birth. So I did that. I saw the midwife. I really, fell in love with her. She was really sweet, very cool, very laid back and relaxing.
Speaker 2
And this is a home birth midwife? Home birth.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Okay. We're, like, two boroughs away from each other. I mean Mhmm. Two hour train ride. It's like
Speaker 2
Oh, wow.
Speaker 3
It's a long I'm Bronx. She's Brooklyn. So but I made it happen. I was like, she's the one that I felt connected to when I was looking up her information, so I'm gonna make it happen. Yeah. Seeing her every month, it was cool, but it was for me, it was like it was a lot because I had to travel so far to see her.
Speaker 2
Yeah. So she didn't come
Speaker 3
to you. Times no. A lot of times, it was like she had a doppler, and she would just listen to the heartbeat. I mean, besides that, it was like maybe taking my blood to figure out my iron levels, things of that nature. But she was very, like, introduce you to certain things, and you could say no to this. So I was like, is this mandatory? No. Okay. No. So I note everything. I I mean, a lot of testing and things of that nature that women normally get, I just said no to. I just that was it. So, I had her for my first birth. Now when that it was beautiful. My first, second birth, they were so, like, light and breezy, and I had my girls. Right? She came to the house, and it was very, very hands off. You know? And but with my first birth, something when it was getting closer to the due date and I don't think I realized at forty two weeks, they transferred you. I don't know. I mean, at the time, I was like you know, my due date came around, and she's like, how do you feel? And I'm like, I'm great. She's like, oh, you're not you know, the baby's not coming anytime soon because I still felt like I could keep going. So at some point, when it was getting closer to forty two weeks, she came and sat with us like, hey. What's going on? And just kind of, you know, ask questions and pick through things and, had us kind of deep dive in ourselves. So me and my husband had a conversation. We cried it out, and there were some things. Like, I've never been afraid of labor. I've never been afraid of birth, pregnancy, anything. I think in that sense, I was afraid of being a new mom, and that was, like, you know, supposedly holding things for me. Whenever we talked, we cried. That same night, my contractions started. I don't know if it's linked to you know, if the baby's gonna come, when it's gonna come, I'm not sure if it you've really had something to do with it or not, but that's what happened. So that birth went smoothly. She bought a doula in with her. I never hired a doula, and I work as a doula. Well, I was working as a doula before my last birth, but I've never hired one myself. So she bought this woman in. She was amazing, hip squeezes, all that good stuff. And I had my baby in the pool. So that was beautiful, and she's the one that caught the baby. You know? She's the midwife, and she kinda slides her under to me. I guess she unraveled the cord and slides her under, and I pull her up and out. So about this similar kind of situation with my second birth, she wasn't there. She was out of town, so she had a stand in midwife, and she was very hands off too. Very just in the room being there with you, letting you do your thing. And that was a beautiful, like, easy breezy. So where so about third birth. I thought third birth, my my son was gonna, like, fly out. Right. This is baby number three. I got this. I have one, two. He's gonna come, like and around that time when I was pregnant with him, I actually considered free. I was like, should I do unassisted birth? And I brought it to my husband, and he's kinda like, are you sure? You sure you wanna do this? And I hadn't really sat and thought about it and consider and then because we had the same midwife for the first two and we were comfortable with her, we were just like, yeah. Let's just go back to her. It's not the thing. But his, birth was the turning point for me.
Speaker 2
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Speaker 3
It it was a roller coaster. So going into his birth, I had which I didn't have with my daughters, I had the I guess, they call it prodrome labor where you well, the the startup of labor when you're feeling a few days and nothing happens, it starts and stops, starts and stops. I had that with him. And then so I knew my body was preparing for him, and he was coming soon. When contractions well, surges I hate calling it contractions. When the surges started, they were back to back. So I was timing them for about a hour or two the way they tell you to time them when which I know different now, but I'm just sharing what I knew at the moment. So once it got to a certain point when they were, you know, steady, I called the midwife. Plus, she's she's so far away, maybe, like, forty some minutes drive. So I called her and she's like, well, do you think you're going to go into labor soon or not? And I'm like, I wish I knew that answer. I can't tell you that. But what I did notice when she picked up the phone, she sound tired and, you know, just not wanting to go at it. Maybe she just came from a birth. I had Well, okay. Yeah. So that energy I did feel. Mhmm. Ten o'clock at night when I called, she's like, well, okay. Well, I'll just come in, I guess, hearing how close or back to back the surgeons were.
Speaker 2
And she's two hours away.
Speaker 3
She's two well, two hours by train. She's probably, like, forty something minutes by car. I didn't have a car in New York, so that's why it was so she gets to us, and it's probably around midnight, maybe maybe a little bit before midnight. So while waiting for her, I just jump in the shower and get out. By the time she gets to us, she comes upstairs, and she checks me, and she, like, just her energy is just like she doesn't wanna be there. And, you know, you feel it. You could sense it.
Speaker 2
That is so
Speaker 3
much better. Very sensitive to energy. My card and everything. I would never take anything from her, but I did feel like she rather be in bed sleeping. You know what I mean? So she texts me, and she's kinda like, okay. You're four centimeters. And she listens to the baby, and her face is just, like, concern. So I'm looking at her like, what's happening? And she's she's checking again. And what I know now, you know, in my experience because I didn't do doula until after that birth. Right? Mhmm. So working as a doula and and, assisting other women through their births, I under like, I know now what the heart rate was supposed to be. But or what's a good range? At the time, I didn't hear going every month to see her and hearing the baby, that sticks in your head. So when she checked me, I didn't hear anything off about it, but she did. She felt like the heart rate was too high. And at the same time she took my temperature, I had a low fever of one zero one. Just random, I guess, fever that popped up. My body is just getting prepared, you know, what I would think of it was. I didn't feel bad. I didn't feel horrible. I just kinda felt like I needed to lay down a little bit. So she was uncomfortable with that, and she goes, okay. I think you guys are gonna have to go to the hospital.
Speaker 2
I mean, this is the this is the thing. Midwives, when they don't wanna be there, manufacture, transfer. They they you know, we we all all of us are collecting evidence for whatever it is we unconsciously believe. Right. And if she unconsciously I don't think I don't think these women do this, you know, in this, like, evil, you know, four brain way, but it is, I think, still evil because it's intentional harm because it's completely unethical. And and this happens all the freaking time.
Speaker 3
It does. I've seen it. I've seen it. As a doula, I've seen it, so I know.
Speaker 2
And how convenient. She said that you've already paid her, and, oh, all of a sudden,
Speaker 3
it's a little warm. And it was only, like, one fifty something in the beginning, but that whoosh that sound, it didn't sound like like everything in me was like, I'm fine. My baby's fine. We're healthy. We're strong. We're good. That's the first thing I heard out of her mouth after Tiffany. I had a fever one zero one, and then my baby's heart rate is high. I think y'all need to go to the hospital. So me and my husband looking at each other like and this is COVID time. Like, high twenty twenty is when I had him. You know? So this is Worst case scenario. Everything's shut down. You being in the hospital, you're not gonna be with your partner. You know? It would just I don't like the hospital on a normal day, so COVID time is gonna be like, no.
Speaker 2
Tell me you didn't go. No. Oh oh, no.
Speaker 3
Thank god.
Speaker 4
Save it.
Speaker 3
Stubborn as a mute.
Speaker 2
Oh, I love that. Okay. I At times I can't stand it.
Speaker 3
Moments where I was like, should I? Am I doing the right thing? And then I'm like, I'm not going. So I just kinda froze, and I was like, my husband saw my face. He read everything without me saying anything. So he turns to her and he's like, well, how much time? Because she said, we gotta get this fever down or whatever. He said, how much time can you give us? She said, two hours, Tuxi.
Speaker 2
He's like, okay. Arbitrary amount
Speaker 3
of time. In this moment, Emilee, this is like in this two hours, we're squatting. We're dancing. I'm walking down the stairs. We're, like, hip circling. I'm doing, like, everything with with teas, whatever I have just to get it's like, get this baby out. Get this baby out or hospital. You know?
Speaker 2
You know, there's there's a a quote by my elder midwife, sister Morning Star. She says, if you wanna stress the baby, stress the mother. Yes. You know? And it's so interesting how these dots are never logically connected. Because if this woman was actually nervous about a tachycardic baby, which would be a stressed out baby, to then, to then especially after so many years of knowing you and serving you, to then suggest a place that that you are so firm on not feeling safe and put that as an ultimatum. You know? Like, it's so contradictory to what would actually help a mother and and most importantly help, you know, the the baby who who in this storyline she's claiming to be concerned about. You know what I'm saying? Right.
Speaker 3
It was just it was horrendous. It was just, like, up and down. And all of these things that we're doing, my contractions I mean, my surgeries are just, like, leaving. So they're stopping Of course. Stopping. Because there's this it's like having to fight your like, you know you're supposed to be in this calm positive space. Right. And then what you're being told by the midwife is, like, not calming at all. It's, like, nerve wracking. So to fight that and still try to place of peace, oh my god. That's like that was crazy to go through. Paradoxical. Yeah. So we get to that two hour mark. My I still have the one on one fever. The car rate is still kinda not where she wants it to be. So she says it again, and we both look at her like like, this is not happening. He's like, my husband, she's not. I don't think she wants to. So she goes and this is hard why I keep myself to this day. I'm hard on myself. But she goes, okay. I know you guys are not like this, and you you don't do this kind of thing, but I know Tylenol to take fevers down fast. So she's like in my mind, I'm like, Tylenol? Hospital. Give me the Tylenol. I don't care. We don't have any in our house. She doesn't have any with her. We literally have to knock on the neighbor's doors after midnight. So my neighbor had, like, a a children's whatever Tylenol. She just gave me the whole bottle. I take one, and at some point, it works. It brings it down. Now I hate Tylenol. It's, like, poison. Like, just but I was like, okay. I took it. It brought it down, but it didn't, like, kick up any con you know, surges or anything. So we're still it's still, like, operation try to get this baby out. Mhmm. That's right. Yeah. So we're going about the day, going about the day. It go you know, middle of the night, it comes back, the fever. Woah. Woah. Woah. So, again, she's saying it again. I really now it's like, I really think you guys need to go to the hospital. And at that point, I just, like I remember sitting on the floor. I just cried because I'm just, like I'm exhausted. I'm like, there's no way in my mind, I'm like, I wish this lady will stop saying this because I'm not fucking going to the hospital. Like, she's gonna have to pry me out of this house. But then that's when you have the battle with yourself. Like, okay. Am I doing the right thing? Am I, like but I'm strongly listening to my intuition over what she's saying because it got to the point where my husband was really like, Joy, I think maybe we should listen and and go to the hospital. It'll be okay. We get your mom over here, blah blah blah. And when he said that, I was crying because I, like, call it a vision, call it whatever. I literally saw my baby being okay and me not making it out. And I was like Woah. Yeah. It just broke down.
Speaker 4
And I
Speaker 3
look at him. I'm like, I'm not going. And she just she just had to stay she stuck it out. She didn't have to, but she stayed. She stayed there. I did not go. And she's like, okay. Well, she had me take a second Tylenol. So take the second Tylenol, and eventually, you know, amongst teas and whatever else it took, it takes the fever away. The fever never comes back after that. But the surges are like, boom boom boom. You know? They're here and then they go away. They're here then they go away. A full day. It was, like, twenty three, twenty four hours. Wow. We went from ten o'clock when I called her, all the way to the next day. My son was, like, born at eight PM.
Speaker 2
You gotta wonder what that birth story would have been if she hadn't have been involved with all the messages.
Speaker 3
I've unpacked that story, like, fifty million times. I'm like, if this would have because I understand. Now I understand he was not ready to come out. Mhmm. Okay. It was like because she was there, because she's on you know, she had to travel all the way from where she came from. I'm on her time clock now. She checked me. I'm kinda in her care. Let's get this baby out when it should have been okay. He's not ready to come out. She coulda went home and left me to about my day. He woulda came maybe the next day or the following day, whatever. I now know we, like, just kinda we're trying to force him out because before to get my surges to really, really keep like, kick in, I remember drinking. She gave me castor oil to drink down. I just made a video of my castor oil. I'm like, don't do it. Don't take the castor oil, but that is what kept him going. So he comes at eight something at nine, and, of course, he needs by the time he's born I mean, once she found out I had a fever, the the water birth was like a a dub. There was no water birth happening. Yeah. She was just like, couldn't be Just Couldn't be in water. She said, I don't know.
Speaker 2
Literally makes no sense. I wonder what their, like
Speaker 3
Logic was. Right? Yeah. She couldn't so he was the only one I had on the bed. So I have to
Speaker 2
have The the only place to birth everyone knows if a mom has a moderate to to low fever.
Speaker 3
It's on the bed. Yeah.
Speaker 2
You also didn't have a fever at the time of delivery.
Speaker 3
No. I did not. Ew. I did not.
Speaker 2
It went away.
Speaker 3
So I
Speaker 2
mean, this is obviously you know, this is what happens when we give our decision making to people, especially people who know nothing about normal physiological birth.
Speaker 3
Right. Right. It was So annoying.
Speaker 2
So how is the actual emergence? Is she, like, super freaked out about baby and assessing baby?
Speaker 3
Or do you get Well, when he comes out? Mhmm. No. She was she's, like, cool as a cucumber normally. Nice. This is why, like I mean, there's really, like, no emotion sometimes on her face. It's like it's kinda hard to read her at some points, and then, but he comes out and he needs a little start up. I actually didn't remember until I watched the video. So we have a little video of his birth, and she had to blow a couple breaths for him.
Speaker 2
Like, with the bag?
Speaker 3
No. Okay.
Speaker 2
And then She but she recessed him, not you.
Speaker 3
Right. And then she handed him to me, and I just kept rubbing like, just just kept going with it. It rubbed his back and just kept him going. So he was his you know, he was he just needed a little start up. He was fine coming out, but you could see he was just Well, but also, did he
Speaker 2
did he need
Speaker 3
a start up? Like I felt it maybe a little, maybe a little, you know, heart to heart and and just
Speaker 2
Oh, of course.
Speaker 3
He's skin. He probably
Speaker 2
would sound like random woman he doesn't know kissing kissing him, you know, and forcing us. You know? Gosh. I just it drives me nuts. It's so crazy to me that that women that providers think it could ever be appropriate to take that from the mother. Like, the mother will always bring a baby to life best.
Speaker 3
Yeah. I believe always. I believe that. I believe that. And after that, that was just like it it was because going through that story over and over and over to myself, I was just like, yeah. This could have gone so differently and so much better. I just I I wouldn't have been forced to do anything. I wouldn't have been forced to get him out. He would've just came when he came. And it was that that changed, you know, that kinda whole deal for me, which is like and not to switch so fast, but so I started working as I did do a training while I was pregnant with him. It's my third pregnancy. So after I felt, like, ready to go, I mean, I stay home, they breastfeed for a long time, and then I'm like, okay. Let me start practicing, you know, putting my my training to work. So I started working with a midwife here in Florida, and that experience, awesome, because I got to see a whole lot. And I got to see what I like and what I don't like and what I agree with and what I don't agree with. And I knew that I was you know, when I got pregnant the fourth time, I was like, I'm not happy. No. There's no midwife because it was I mean, as awesome as a person as she is, I just something she would do would literally I would have to leave. I mean, I'm sure you're you're I know you're impact too. I'm I'm like impact times ten, and I I feel everything. And I've the energy and then some some things just like letting moms birth on their back, and moms would literally come in, and they would want to be on all fours. And they just they wanted any position but their back, and they will end up birthing on their backs.
Speaker 2
Oh, of course.
Speaker 3
I would just be like, oh, I'm, like, struggling because and internally because I can't you know, Joy can't say anything for you, this little doula. And I've been a midwife for this amount of years, and I know what I'm doing. So it's like holding that stuff in, it became it was a lot for me. It was a lot for me to see, but it was a lot of good experience so that I, you know, I just kinda went further with that. I read more and looked up and looked into more natural ways of doing this and that and third. So I was ready. And even when I kinda kept it quiet too, going into this fourth birth because I was like, everyone's not gonna understand. They don't understand me anyway. I'm just, like, the black weirdo of the family, so they don't understand me anyway. But, you know, I was the first to do what I did as a home birth. I mean, the first that I know of. I don't have anybody in my family who who has done it outside the hospital. You know? So that was like, okay. Well, that's Joy. Leave her alone. So when I went when I decided to do a free birth, I know my mom was like, she was not feeling that. And she attended every single birth. This one, except for the last one, because it was hard for her because we're in two different states now. But I think another part of it was because she didn't a hundred percent agree with my decision, and that's fine. I was like, it's okay. But when I say the best decision I've ever made, I'm not and we want more, and it's just gonna be free birthing from here on out because regardless of what anyone had to say or oh, I should I I yeah. That's awesome. But I think you should get a midwife just in case this happened. Just in case. So I was like, you know what? Just in case this happened, I could do this. Just in case this and so I really read up on, you know, possible complications and natural ways to handle them. So I was
Speaker 2
And and it's always kind of funny with those people to be like, just in case what? Yes. Like like, what what do you think would happen that a medical midwife would magically save the life of me and my baby? Like, please tell me. No one knows shit.
Speaker 3
No. You're gonna go, oh, I don't know. Isn't it just, the heart rate? Like, it's the idea of because they went to school for x amount of years that they know way more than you know. Same thing in the medical, you know, the the hospitals and stuff. This person went to school To be fair,
Speaker 2
there are definitely branches of medicine. Like, I don't know how to fix a broken bone.
Speaker 3
Right. You know what
Speaker 2
I mean? But that is, like you said sick sick and broken and diseased and blah blah blah. I mean, I don't know. I could be argued that I don't know that disease people should be in the hospital. But but but, like, broken bone. Let's go there. I'm not gonna argue that. A broken bone you know, because of the eradication of all medicine people of our cultures and lineages, there are no people that know how to fix bones. Of course, people in history knew how to do that that weren't doctors. Of course. It's not like only a hundred years ago, like, the white man came over from England and brought fixing bones. Like, that's that's not real. It's been eradicated. And so the only option is to come to, like, the satanic, you know, central, you know, stations that are in all in every city and get your, you know, bone fixed and hopefully not get abused and humiliated and and, you know, everything else in the process. But I digress.
Speaker 3
You are on point with that, though.
Speaker 2
But it's it's completely different when we're talking about a biological event.
Speaker 3
It
Speaker 2
is. It's it would be funny if it wasn't so dark. You know? There is a layer of satire to this whole thing because it's so absurd. Yeah. So you're just like, it's free birth or bust. People aren't gonna get it. That's fine. Mhmm. And tell me how this goes in your marriage. It you know, does he skip a beat? Does he take a minute? Or is it just really is he on board with you? What's that like?
Speaker 3
He had anxiety in the beginning. He was like, are you sure? But because he trusts me and my judgment and he he knows I, like, have dissected and read, and he just trusted my judgment and intuition and knowledge on all this. And he's like, okay, babe. I'm with you on this. But to kinda, like, ease his mind, I gave him a book to read. I was like, here, read this. I think it was, like, the unassisted birth or whatever, and I was like, read that. It'll make you feel better because he's very he's Aquarius, very logical. He needs you know, things need to make sense, and and he needs facts, and he needs things of that nature. So I was like, read this. It'll make you feel better, and it did. It made him feel better. He's still going to be, like because he's the protector of the family and you know? But he was on board. He was like, I'm with it. If you feel great, I'm great. Like, I'm just let's do it.
Speaker 2
I think it's also such a good point, you know, for women listening who are navigating this because it's very normal for or not normal. It's very common for, you know, partners to, have hesitation or or nervousness or, as Joyce said, anxiety. And I think it's important to say here that, that's fine.
Speaker 3
It is.
Speaker 2
It's totally fine if your partner is scared, if he doesn't get it, if he, makes up that if he were a woman, he'd make a different decision. Like, it's fine. You know, I do so many sessions with women who are like, you know, I wanna I wanna do it this way, but I can't because my husband's not on board. And it's like, wow. So you've made up that your life is based your decision making is based on his comfort level. Right. And that's silly. Somebody's fear should not be the leader of your decision making.
Speaker 3
Exactly.
Speaker 2
And so you're a beautiful example of this, of it's completely fine that he was nervous. You know, what is anxiety? It's fear. Right?
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 2
So he had fear. Of course, he did. Like, of court not all men do. But when they do, I always say, of course you do.
Speaker 3
Right. Why wouldn't you until you know? Go through it. They're not the ones birthing. They're not the ones
Speaker 2
But also, he's been highly, highly groomed to be terrified of this. Right. You know? And he's unraveling that, you know, by being at your side. But but, of course, he's afraid, and you are the one, obviously, that has to do it. But, also, you're the one in the marriage for this particular situation that has the clarity and the intuition. Well, then that makes you the goddamn leader. Like, why is that so hard for everyone to understand?
Speaker 3
It's not that hard. It's easy. Like, I've had I've had that, I've heard people say stuff like that, and then the same reason why they don't want to birth at home or anything of that nature because their husband was in. And it's your I feel like it's a woman's job to just school him. School him a little bit. If you know, you know more than he knows about this.
Speaker 2
Well, yes. But you gotta be careful with the whole schooling thing because that's a very heroic persona women will take on. Will they'll where there will it's it's very misogynistic because they'll be like, like, women all the time, you know, contact us and they're like, can you give me the research on why I shouldn't circumcise or why I shouldn't do vitamin k? My husband doesn't my husband isn't on board. He needs the facts. He's very science based. He needs the facts. And so my point is that she is taking on his work. If he wants the facts, look it up. It's never been easier to learn about this stuff, but women take on so often this really bizarre, and really, like, toxic dynamic where she has to convince him to be on board with her decision making, which is a really, weird hierarchical dynamic that's not gonna bode well also in an autonomous birth.
Speaker 3
Right. Anyway because he you need the energy to be peaceful all around when you're birthing. You know? And just, like, grow up. Yeah.
Speaker 2
When are you gonna be an adult? You're about to have a baby.
Speaker 3
But a lot of times, I mean, if when you look up things online, it's very misleading. So you can't
Speaker 2
true. Everything. I mean, you need to know where to look. That's totally
Speaker 3
true. You do.
Speaker 2
And there's a difference of, like, being curious about something versus doing all of the work for your partner so that he doesn't feel fear, so that you are allowed to do what you want. Like, that's a dynamic I see playing out over and over again. It's very strange. Okay. But, anyway, back back to you. So so, where are we? So it's obvious to you what you're doing. And is there anything else you wanna say about your pregnancy before you tell us your free birth story? And do you have a wild pregnancy? Like, what decisions do you make there?
Speaker 3
The pregnancy was so I'm I love to work out. Normally, when I get pregnant, I slow it up a little bit. You know? I'm not doing anything, like, crazy, like, before. So I go in hardcore before pregnancy. Pregnancy, I kinda mellow out and just kinda maintain. But this pregnancy, the fourth one, I chilled. This was the most relaxed pregnancy. I was I think number one, I was out of the city. I wasn't in crazy New York City. Mhmm. I didn't have to travel trains and be around, you know, strange people all day long. Oh my gosh. I was in, you know, the the Florida sunshine all the time. So I literally maybe I worked out a couple times here and there, but I, like, sat back. It was so relaxed. Had my every day. I'm just like, oh, I'm just in my little world, not stressing anything, and it just it felt so good. It felt good not to have to see anyone, not have to have to be checked, not to, you know, be like, oh, this is your timeline. And then once you get closer, feel freaked out if your baby's not, you know, on their time. And, you know, all my children I hate due dates, but all my children come well after the damn stupid due date. But this was the most free as far as pregnancy goes, free pregnancy that I had, most relaxed ever. I didn't have to, you know, do much of anything other than what I normally do in my household. So we get two, and he is so I guess he was due whatever in April. So I'm thinking he's gonna be April Aries, like, my first son. And he just I would feel surges and then nothing, and I would feel surges, and then it'll go away. And my and what what I want women to understand too is your water will leak for days sometimes, you know, and people get freaked out about that too. But I trickled here and then nothing. And then I have a surge here and then nothing. So that carried on. But when it started when I say he came so so fast, we, like the night when the surgery started, they kicked in, and they were I mean, some mild and I don't wake my husband for anything. You know? It's mild, mild, mild, but they're coming back to back, and I'm like, okay. Maybe it's time. Maybe it's time. So once it started getting a little stronger, you know the sensation already. I'm like, I know. It's time. I said, babe, okay. Think we gotta get up and just blow up the pool. Right? Fill it up. Literally, the moment he finished filling the pool and I stepped in, my son was coming out. Like, it was that fast. It was so amazing. And I had I had my coconut water. I had my teas ready. I had tinctures if I needed it. My children wanted to be involved. They were asleep because it was was early morning, but when I stepped in the pool and felt I was like, you better wake them up now because they're gonna miss it. He woke them up so they could be there. So they were with me. My daughter was trying to record, and she got some a lot of nothing, most of my behind and nothing else. But he came so fast, and it was it was beautiful. It was beautiful. I mean, I think, what, three surges and he was out. Wow. It was amazing. And I just pulled him up and, you know, getting to pick him up yourself and not have anybody touch your baby before you touch your baby was, like, everything. And just, you know, rub him a little bit, rub him, and just hear him cry. It was beautiful. It was beautiful. And, I mean and it's like all of that. And the first thing after everything kinda calmed down, my husband and I cry, first thing I think about is calling my mom. Like, you know, you go into this, like, little girl, boy, I need to call my mom. It is I think a part of me really wish she was there too because she attended the first three births, but it was it was amazing. I would I mean, I can't stress it enough how how free like and I understand not you know, from the third birth and walking stairs and doing this and squatting and oh my it's just nonsense. It's nonsense. It doesn't make any sense. You're just tiring yourself off nothing because your baby's gonna come when he or she's gonna come, and that's just what it is. And, you know, that's I learned that, you know, big old lesson that pregnancy because
Speaker 2
But you're not allowed that spaciousness when you work within the medical model. It's that simple. You're just not allowed the spaciousness that a lot of babies are going to require.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. You are not. That was I mean and it was it's I can't I can't even explain in words how amazing and empowering and freeing that experience was. I'm like, I never wanna bring a baby into this world any other way now. Like, it's strictly free birthing for me here on out. Like, that's that's
Speaker 2
So what so so kind of, like, maybe we could wrap on this note then. Like, could could you articulate a bit when you say, you you know, this is the way for you? Like, why? What does it give you and your family that is so so notable and so amazing for you that it's so clear this is the way?
Speaker 3
I think peace, and it's it's just not feeling pressure. Like, we're we're kinda loners. Right? We're out here. We're in Florida kinda by ourselves and everything like that. We don't always it's kinda hard to find individuals in our area on our frequency and energy. Just putting that out there. So having peace is very important for us. Not to when I had a midwife and yeah. Although it was like that was the experience in itself and of and she was wonderful, but I don't like people all in my space. Do you understand? Like, it's like being checked and and having to and I remember having to fill out, food journals, and I'm like Oh, god. I'm a this crazy person. Do I really need to tell you what I eat? Like, it was just somebody else. They may be like, wow. This is awesome. It was a pain in the ass for me to have to go through.
Speaker 2
Also, you know, you keep saying, like, oh, she's so amazing. Duh duh. You're so wonderful. But she also completely sabotaged your third birth. Like, sabotaged your birth.
Speaker 3
She did. Because I'm not that's the nice part of me that's like, oh, I don't wanna like, I don't wanna throw anybody under the bus, but it's like
Speaker 2
But also when do you call a spade a spade? Like, you know, I mean, it her her, supposed so called care was so horrible for you that you never wanted it again. Like, she ended midwifery for you.
Speaker 3
And that's what that's what freaked some people in my family out because they heard what happened with the third birth, and they're kinda like, oh, because they're seen as, like, saviors. Oh, because saviors. Boring. Yeah. And it's like, why would you do it without anyone present if this doesn't happen during your third birth? You know? And it's like, you don't even understand the half of it.
Speaker 2
I don't.
Speaker 3
That this would've went such a different way if she was not even there. And that's just
Speaker 2
It's like it's like imagine a culture where whenever you have sex with your partner, there's a third person there. And they're there to just kind of, like, you know, chart some notes and give some tips, and sometimes they get involved, but, like, you don't love them. You're not, like, turned on by them. They're they're a professional in the room. And this is how everybody has sex in this culture. You know, they just they have to have a third party. You arrange it. You hire someone. They come. They watch you have sex. They give you pointers. They assess you. Sometimes, you know, they they put things into his butt and they put things into your cavities, and they just you know, this is all part of the culture. And then all of a sudden, you get real sneaky one time and you have sex without calling the professional. And you husband are like, oh, shit. Much better. That is something there. There is some comparison there.
Speaker 3
That is per no. It makes perfect sense because there's there's a moment where you're just like even in the third birth, like, I went upstairs and I was by myself laboring for a long time, and I liked it that way. Everybody else is downstairs, and it was just, like, peaceful. But there's a moment where you're feeling that peace and kind of tranquility, and then you have that interruption, by someone checking your yoni for a second. Dilation. It's just like, I don't want to be part of it. Look at my little one.
Speaker 2
Little one. What's really gnarly too is that everyone knows providers all know that there's no evidenced based reason to do that. So then that's when you actually stop and think, oh, that's actually pretty dark that providers know. Whether they'll admit it to their clients or not, providers know that there is no evidence. There's no, evidence based benefit to the mother Right. To do a cervical exam, and yet it is a abuse ritual that they continue to do. Like, explain that. You know? I mean, that's really a dark, dark practice.
Speaker 3
It's it's unnecessary in the
Speaker 2
But this is your third walking around.
Speaker 3
This is my third. This is the Yeah.
Speaker 2
I was like, that's not a one year old. See? This is very advanced.
Speaker 3
That third. Mhmm.
Speaker 2
Well, this is a perfect time to end. Any, anything you wanna say before we end? How can people find you online?
Speaker 3
You can find me on Morphew Mama, TikTok, predominantly, but TikTok and Instagram, you can find me on Morphew at CMOS. Come get I'm like, come get our Sea Moss. Right? We have one that's called baby mama that I'm so proud of because it took the three herbs that I used throughout all of my pregnancies, and we just combined it with Sea Moss and made, like, just a powerhouse of a supplement. Nice. So I've taken that I'm drinking it now in my little, like, witchy cup.
Speaker 2
Goblet. Your goblet. Yes. Well, thank you, Joy. Yeah. We'll put those links in the show notes, and thank you so much for your time. I love your
Speaker 3
stories.
Speaker 2
I hope you enjoyed the show today. You can support this podcast by donating to it through the link in the show notes below and, of course, leaving an awesome review on whatever platform you listen on. The more reviews, the more visibility the show gets, so let's spread the good word of Sovereign Birth. Don't forget, you can watch our podcast interviews on YouTube and see the women as they tell their birth and power stories, And you'll also find our viral free birth collection of epic, raw birth videos on our YouTube. Make sure you're subscribed to our channel. We've always got a lot going on at Free Birth Society, and you can find out all about it at free birth society dot com, at free birth society on Instagram, and opt in to my newsletter below. We offer courses on free birth, authentic midwifery, the blood mysteries, as well as one on one coaching, in person retreats, and, of course, our annual women's gathering, the matriarch rising festival. Our exclusive private vetted membership, the lighthouse, is definitely something to check out if you're looking for a community of wise sisters sisters to get guidance from and to meet in real life. Together, we rise sisters. We must speak our stories, fully claim our lives, and support one another. This is the living revolution, and I am so grateful to be in it with all of you. I'll leave you with our gorgeous free birth society theme song, Wild Woman by Aruba Red.
Speaker 4
I honor you for the wisdom you held, the ancient traditions of plant medicine and womb magic. I portal will be honored, Eons upon light beams of survival, withstanding the eradication of our power by design. I will not allow the separation of our young to be forced upon me. My sisters will no longer birth in captivity. The picket line we define from burning our wild women to paralyzing us and drugging our babes. Strapped down in a clinical white bed, drying up the milk from our breasts, keep your needles. My family will never again be doomed to chase those dragons all your poison. We reject your fear. We choose love. Everything with intention, death, ascension. I will fly and bring her back from the star. Conscious inception. Conscious conception. Wild woman, she still lives in inside. Wild woman, from you, I will not hide. They could not bend your spirit away, so please teach me your way. I'm ready to
