Speaker 0
Welcome to the Free Birth Podcast, a supportive space for people who are learning, exploring, and celebrating their autonomous choices in childbirth. Together, we'll unpack truths, share personal stories, and claim our ability to birth freely and intuitively. Here's your host, Emily Saldea.
Speaker 1
Hi, everyone. Quick note at the top of the show here. If you wanna support the podcast, you can find me on patreon dot com slash free birth podcast, or head over to the website, free birth society dot com, and you can donate via PayPal if you wanna contribute a one time payment. Thank you so much. We are back this week with part two of Katya's free birth story of baby Phoenix. She also shares ten helpful tips for postpartum recovery. Let's dive in. Welcome back for this week to finish off your birth story.
Speaker 2
Thank you so much, Emily. I guess we're just a chatty Cathy.
Speaker 1
I know.
Speaker 2
We've got so much to
Speaker 1
share. Let's go ahead and start with your prenatal experience with Phoenix from anywhere you really wanna start, whether finding out that you're pregnant or, you know we already talked about your choice around free birthing, but how did that how did that look and play into your choices around prenatal care?
Speaker 2
Mhmm. First, I wanna say that my pregnancy was very different this time And, it's funny how most people say that if the pregnancy is very different, it's probably a baby of a different gender, but that was not the case. Both my babies are boys, so pregnancy can look very, very differently. And this time around, I was just tired the whole time. Just crazy fatigue. I didn't do almost any yoga. I did so much yoga with with Zion, but with Phoenix, I just wanted to rest. There was this deep need to be still, and I honored that. And so it's perfectly fine not to be doing splits and and lunges if if you don't feel like it. And so well, if, for any listeners who have already heard the part one of the story, they know that we live in Dominican Republic, and our choices here are very limited in terms of, prenatal care and and birthing choices. And so our decision not to receive prenatal care in the conventional sense was not a rejection of the midwifery model or rejection of medical care as some people see it. I really wanna reiterate reiterate that. It was just that we did the best with what was available or, actually, what wasn't available to us. And I, I wanna say that I just felt so tuned in the whole time with my body, and I had faith that I would know if something was was wrong. And Rob and I were absolutely ready to, of course, go to the hospital here, go to to see an OB if we felt that something was terribly wrong, god forbid. But I trusted that that I was fine. And, you know, if in my regular daily life, I'm not taking my blood pressure all the time, or checking my heart rate, I didn't really need to do that when I felt really healthy in my pregnancy. Mhmm. And so what when Rob and I, were entertaining the idea of free birthing, we started looking into, well, what what are we gonna need for the birth, or what are we gonna need kind of to do our own prenatal care? And so I actually ordered on Amazon, the device to take my own blood pressure, and I ordered a doppler. And, ironically, the doppler never came, and I was so worried of yeah. It's it's weird because we get everything just fine, but the doppler mysteriously did not show up. And I was a little bit worried. I was like, well, my midwife with my first birth used it, so what are we gonna do? You know? We need to do all these good things, like take my vitals and take the baby's vitals. And then right around that that time, I listened to, one of the incredible episodes on the Indie Birth podcast, Taking Taking Back Birth, specifically about, all kinds of measuring in in prenatal care. And is it is it really needed? And, if you're interested, you can go have a listen, so I won't go into details too much about it. But it basically made me realize that it might not be something that we're gonna need, Rob and I, stopping and checking the baby's heart rate if if everything feels fine. And in the birth itself, I don't know if we would have done any anything with a Doppler at all, looking back now because I was healthy and fine, and everything felt beautiful and just as it should be. And using the doppler to, to take the baby's vitals would have really taken me out of, my my birthing my birthing space, outer space, if that makes any sense.
Speaker 1
For sure. Yeah. Definitely. I'm wondering I'm wondering because you said it's not a rejection of of those systems. I'm wondering if you were in a different culture
Speaker 2
or, you
Speaker 1
know, if you were back in Canada, would you have I guess, you probably can't really say for sure, but but do you think you would have done midwifery care or or obstetrical care?
Speaker 2
Yeah. That's such a good question and a very important question because I don't know. Right. If if I would have, if I would have found or had been connected to a midwife that I really resonated with, I may not have ever even looked into having a free birth. Or or maybe we would have done things exactly the same way, and this was just an experience that was that that was right for us. I have no idea. So this brings us to an important point. Every woman listening, please don't take advice from me. Listen to your own intuition. And, yeah, it's not at all the rejection of midwifery model. I am in awe of every woman who is a birth professional, whether it's a doula or a traditional midwife or whatever whatever kind of birth professional. These women are incredible, and we need them. I hope to be one one day, actually, when I'm an old and wise crone, but this just is something that felt felt right right for us. Mhmm.
Speaker 1
Totally. I mean, I even know quite a few midwives who free birth themselves because of the rules and regulations, you know, to to contract with another midwife would be too limiting for for their own personal choices. Kind of interesting.
Speaker 2
Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. And you also have to ask yourself. What is prenatal care? Yeah. Exactly. You know, if if it's going to the hospital and getting a scan and getting, you know, with all these machines hooked up to you and just writing down in a chart a bunch of numbers, is that is that prenatal care? I just didn't feel like I would be missing out on anything if I didn't do that. Mhmm. You know?
Speaker 1
Yeah. And I mean a lot of it is is quite truly looking for something wrong and that is you know a framework that doesn't really fit the way that we wanna approach pregnancy. You know there are you know when you don't when you can't meaning that when you're not relying on someone else to assess you you assess yourself and you do not need to be a genius, you know medical super educated person to assess yourself. You know how do you feel Is something happening that's concerning you? Do you Mhmm. Do you not feel well? You know, pregnancy is the state of optimal health. Birth is a state of health. And so, you know, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out if they feel off inside of themselves or if something's concerning. And this is such a huge part of free birth is taking that power back to say, I am my prenatal care. You know, self care is my prenatal care, and I can assess myself. And, of course, I can also ask for help when I'm confused about something. It doesn't mean that we never want a midwife to palpate our belly or to, you know, check our vitals or whatever it is that a woman might choose. You know, it's just the distinction is I'm assessing and then asking for help versus, you know, like like we know, normal prenatal care is, yeah, just super routine. It's just all this averages and numbers and, pretty pretty soulless.
Speaker 2
Yes. Yes. And I have to confess, I actually, Rav and I really wanted to find out the sex of the baby this time, which in retrospect, we kind of regret. We wish we would have kept it a secret, surprise again. But we went, for a scan when I was about seventeen or eighteen weeks with Phoenix. And, we just went to find out the sex. And so she she began, she began working on me and she said, Oh, I think I think it's a male. And we saw a tiny little penis. And just as we saw that, I actually asked her to stop, to stop the ultrasound, to to turn everything off. And she was really startled and confused, but we said,
Speaker 1
you know, that's that's just what we wanted. We got
Speaker 2
what we wanted. We don't want any any measurements, any other tests. And what I felt was kind of anxiety. I felt like I wanted that device away from me, away from my baby, away from my belly, which is kind of, yeah, like, animalistic, kind of primal. Mhmm.
Speaker 1
When you learn so much more by seventeen weeks pregnant with Phoenix than than you probably had with the previous pregnancy. Yeah questions so much more.
Speaker 2
Yeah. So that was a that was a consent. That was a little confession. But I'm sure you know so many stories, and I've personally heard so many stories of false positives on scams. Oh my gosh. Which is really scary.
Speaker 1
Yeah. I and I've not just that, but even the the gender. I've been to births where they, you know, thought that they had had a a girl all along, and they're about to birth their girl, and it's a girl, it's a girl, and it's a freaking boy, which is That's right. Not nearly as big of a deal as a false positive or or a flag for, you know, a flag for downs or, you know, any of the
Speaker 2
Of course.
Speaker 1
Any of the super scary stuff that gets flagged that, you know, oh my gosh, it's so stressful. We could obviously go down a whole rabbit hole there, but how many people get, you know, told your baby could have x y z, but we won't know until it's born. And then you spend your pregnancy just scared. And, you know, most of the time, it's nothing. It's absolutely nothing. So I I have been thinking a lot this week about ultrasounds and I feel like I I understand why people get them on a whole new level this week than my thirteen years in birth work. Because I am now, you know, towards the end of my pregnancy and and, you know, in the idea I'm not tempted at all. I wouldn't do it for a number of reasons. But the idea that I could get a little, you know, an echo of a sound wave that would give me an idea, you know, of of how things were going or what they look like, is very tempting and very Yeah. You know, we're very indoctrinated to want outside validation and technology and someone else to tell me that I'm okay. And it's really deep, deep, deep work to not have that for sure.
Speaker 2
Yes. Emily, you have to share your mantra. Would you please share your mantra with our with our tribe?
Speaker 1
Yeah. We remember what it is. It's it's I I haven't bled, I feel something moving, and my abdomen is expanding.
Speaker 2
Oh, I adore you.
Speaker 1
Anytime. What just to give some context for the listeners, anytime that I I've had, like, that real trippy, heady pregnancy about, am I really pregnant? Is this real? You know, I just kinda look like I ate, like, a pizza. I'm like, I've been really just, like it's really been heady to not, to not seek any outside, you know, people to track with me. And, of course, I'm pregnant. Logically, all things would deduce this. But it I really even now at almost thirty weeks, I still have these, like, is there really a baby? Is there is that is this real? And, I think a part of it is the seeing is believing, you know. And and the ultrasound gives you a bypass to that where you can feel like you saw. And, you know, I don't I'm choosing not to take that little shortcut. And so anyway. So, yeah, if I just say to myself, okay. Let's go over the facts. I haven't bled. I feel something moving, and my stomach is getting bigger. Those three things must, must mean pregnancy.
Speaker 2
I love it. Not not your typical mantra. A very effective one.
Speaker 1
Yeah. That's me. Awesome. Well, anything else you wanna share about your pregnancy before we jump into your birth story with Phoenix?
Speaker 2
I think that just about covers it. Well, it was forty weeks and and a little bit, and I gotta tell you, I'm so happy that I discovered macrame.
Speaker 1
I know. I love those pose. How did it how did it feel to go past your forty weeks this time?
Speaker 2
I was so impatient. Yeah. And that's a quality that, shows up in other areas in my life. So it was definitely a fitting a fitting life lesson to to let go of of all expectations. And we were expecting this one to show up early because some people say the second one comes early, which again, there is no formula. Babies come when they come. And it was really nice that at one point I, I was meditating, with my hands on my belly, and I felt like Phoenix was speaking to me, and he said, Mom, chill out. I'm not like Zion. Don't expect me to come. Don't expect me to come at thirty six or thirty seven weeks. I'm a completely different spirit, completely different baby. Just chill out. Mhmm. And that was really nice. Yeah. But, it was a Sunday at the time of this recording exactly three weeks ago. And Rob and I had planned to just have a beautiful Sunday fun day watching Netflix and made some beautiful food. And I was working on this beautiful macrame piece that would be kind of the the birth piece for Phoenix. And I just loved that I could use it as a meditation to calm my nerves.
Speaker 1
Yeah. Like, I'm gonna have to try that.
Speaker 2
Because you know what? I ran out of freaking podcast. I was just binging on podcast and couldn't do anything else. So it's good that he came when he came. I got a lot of practice contractions with this with this pregnancy. Didn't have any with my first. And for, I would say, about a week or maybe ten days before Phoenix came her side, I would get these psychedelic experiences. And I I can't think of a better word to describe what I was feeling. It was like when you take the perfect amount of psychedelic drugs, like, the perfect amount of MDMA at Burning Man. If anybody knows what I'm talking about, great. If not, great also, but I would
Speaker 1
So you were feeling that before the birth? Before the birth. Like fading into it. For a week. Yeah.
Speaker 2
Nice. That's awesome. Especially, yeah, especially in the evening time, I would have to stop what I was doing if if there was, you know, Netflix on or whatever I was doing. I had to sit down and I would close my eyes and moan, like, I'm just going somewhere somewhere else. It was super cool. So I thought, oh, maybe this is it. And then I just thought, you know what? Whatever. I'm loving this. Please, more of this. And it was full moon on the fifth of October. It was the last time we went out to the beach, and I was just swaying and moaning, and it just felt orgasmic, it felt ecstatic, and that's
Speaker 1
something you because you did carry a little bit later, you got to really fade into it in this really magical way that doesn't sound like you got with with Zion.
Speaker 2
Yeah, it was super cool. It was absolutely incredible. And so, yeah, I was still making macrame knots on that Sunday fun day. I was refusing to believe that things were happening, but, I started getting these waves, and I was just dancing and doing macrame. And Rob and I had a beautiful meal, and he's like, you know what, babe? I think that things are happening. And I just loved that we had our birthday birth little cave, little den. I didn't have to go anywhere. I didn't have to get into a car. Everything was just there. We had a birth pool that's been leaning up against the wall in our bedroom for, like, a month. And Rob, put these rings, secured them into a wall so that I had something to pull down on
Speaker 1
Nice.
Speaker 2
This time. So, yeah, things started off really slow, and Rob had to go and work for a bit. And when he came back, he saw that the Netflix was off, and I had my birth playlist playing, and I was burning some stage and just dancing and making macrame knots. And he's like, okay. I think it's showtime. So it was I am it was about, I don't know, maybe four hours of kind of light euphoric dancing through waves, and then things got pretty intense. They got into the pool. And I have to tell you that this is this is the most extraordinary thing. And for for anybody listening, I just I just pray that maybe there can be even one woman who can be helped by what I'm about to share, would be amazing. And I had done so much work, as we all do in our own way, to prepare for the birth. Whatever you do, breath work, reading, meditation, all of that work. And I felt like, you know what? This is this is my time to go deep. Mhmm. We've talked about we've talked about birth to, you know, we've talked it to death. To birth. There's no more talking.
Speaker 1
Yeah.
Speaker 2
This is it. This is my opportunity to take back my birth. For every woman who's been wronged, for every woman who's been mistreated, I owe this to myself. I owe this to my sisters. I owe this to my baby. I'm doing this. And it was such a powerful moment because the contractions were getting pretty intense, and I was brought back to the memories of my first birth when I just was grasping, you know, to pull on something, to to scream, to have somebody say something to me to make it better. And I realized that I can either go down that path where I can, you know, grasp the edge edge of the pool or hold on to Rob or sink my nails into him, or I can go down a completely different path. I can go deeper into the waves, ride the waves, and figure this out. Just surrender and trust. And I remember particularly the exact contraction where I went deep and I thought to myself, wow. Okay. So Rob is going to no longer be able to time my time my contractions. And it was I I might might have even had a smile on my face because I thought, Rob probably thinks that I'm either taking a break or my contractions stopped or, like, you know, something's going on. But they were full on, and I just decided that I was going in all the way deep. Mhmm. And as a little side note, there was one podcast or lecture that I'd heard where an elder midwife was talking about women who are either in a coma or women who are quadriplegic, so they're paralyzed, and are well unable to move are but are able to have brilliant natural vir vaginal births because the uterus is is, you know, still able to to work.
Speaker 1
Because birth happens.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Exactly. And they have these beautiful births, and they don't tear. And I just thought that just just blew my mind. And I thought to myself, what if I can go that deep to a level of relaxation that deep, that I could just surrender to that point? And it was work. It was definitely work after making that decision. And I remember being in the in the bath in the in the tub or in the in the pool, and it felt so good. And I was just doing this work. And I remember one butt cheek cheek clenching. And I was like, nope. Nope. Let go. Let go. My my body was I was it was a lot of work, but it was beautiful work to fully surrender. Because to surrender, you can't just tell yourself surrender, surrender, surrender. Mhmm. While you're, you know, holding like digging your nails into your partner's back or something like that. You really have to just go there. And, reflecting back on that with Rob, he he was so impressed because he said he realized at some point that I was not taking a break, that I just really went to that place. And
Speaker 1
Well, and it's like it's like what you oh, so sorry. There was a there was a delay, so I thought you had taken a breath. Sorry. Finish your thought.
Speaker 2
No. No. That's it. I'm just really excited to remember it.
Speaker 1
Yeah. I I was just gonna say, you know, this thinking about what you described about Zion's birth and this caged animal and and really wanting, you know or or could have really used a lot of reassurance or wanting to pull on something and, like, get that energy out and all of this, kind of feeling like a little caged. And then this choice to like you said, I mean, I can just see it so clearly. There's, like, this crossroads where you can so easily stay there and need to escape it and need outside stuff to somehow pacify it or, you know, or or or help manage it. And the other option, and I don't think it's an easy option, but in a way, it does wind up being easier, you know, ultimately to dive underneath the water and go into that deep end and go the layers below, you know, that that surface caged kind of feeling of needing to escape. And what happens in that deep, deep, deep water is exactly what you're describing. It's so it's so important to remember that that is a choice within us if we know it's a choice, and therefore, we can choose it.
Speaker 2
Yes. And thank you for contrasting it so beautifully. That's why I thought it was important to share both both stories from both perspectives, because I was at the same crossroads in both births and just had a completely different experience this time. Yeah. Yeah. So, I just felt that things were happening so fast and I I was opening really quickly in the in the pool. And there was just no reason to resist, because if I was gonna resist, it's just gonna take longer. And, you know, I was just I was made to do the hard thing. It it was okay. It was okay to open and to let it happen. And at some point, I remember thinking, oh my lord. This is hard. I I don't know. This is way I, like, I'm over my way over my head. And as soon as I had those thoughts, of course, I remembered the million birth stories that I've heard before. And that those thoughts are, very indicative of being in transition.
Speaker 1
Hopefully. Oh, yeah. Fucking hopefully.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Often often they are when you think, I can't do this. You know, when you feel totally defeated, you're most likely very close to meeting your baby. But I just really lost track of time, and I thought there's no frigging way that I'm already there. And so, I wanted to turn to Rob and say, I can't do this. This is hard. And I remembered, like, no, no, no. I'm not doing it. Not gonna tell him. So I think I said, this is hard. And a few minutes after that, I just really felt the urge to do something different to get out of the tub. And so I climbed onto our bed, and almost immediately my water released and it was so satisfying. I bet. So good. And a few minutes after that, I got that feeling that I wanted just to rest for a little bit. Nice. And, you know, it's funny because I was on our bed and I had spent so many days propped up by pillows, you know, like three pillows between my legs and pillows everywhere. And I had all those same pillows on that same bed with me right then. And I was just longing to rest propped up by those pillows. And I did. And, it felt so wonderful because there was nobody telling me to push my baby out or to do something different. I don't know how long it lasted, not very long, but it felt really, really beautiful. And then I got the urge to push and that was so empowering and just wild. I loved it. I could feel the baby coming down with every wave, and the urge to push was overpowering. I didn't get anything like that with the first Yeah. With the first birth. And I thought that I would tell myself to slow down, to kind of pant, and, of course, I wanted to make sure that I that I didn't tear and that, I was breathing well, but there was no way of stopping it. Yeah. Such a powerful force, and I was on all fours on the bed, And, yeah, I think it was maybe three or four three or four surges, three or four pushes, a total, and Phoenix's head was born. And I remember exactly the song that was playing on on, on my playlist, and it's so hilarious. I looked up at the computer to see what time it was. So, you know, with half of him still inside me because I wanted to know his birth time. Sure. And, it was that moment or those couple of minutes are the best moments of my entire life up until this point because I was so sure that this was happening and my baby was safe, and his body would be born on the next surge. And that time between contractions when his head was born, but his body was still still inside me, it felt like an eternity, but Mhmm. I was just breathing and smiling, and Rob didn't say a thing. He was just at the foot of the bed, And he's so sweet. Bless his heart. He said, babe, do you wanna catch him? Because we had had a conversation after listening to, I think, one of the IndieBirth podcasts about how wonderful it is for the microbiome of the baby if the mom if the mom catches it, on top of, of course, being such a powerful experience to catch a wrong baby. But I yeah. I couldn't care. I was like, no. Just I can't. I don't wanna move.
Speaker 1
I because you're in hands and knees?
Speaker 2
Yeah. I was on hands and knees. Exactly. So but he's so sweet. He he wanted to meet he was right there, but he wanted to make sure that, to remind me that Yeah.
Speaker 1
Good. We could
Speaker 2
catch him if I wanted to. It's beautiful. And I gave him I gave him the green light and, Phoenix's slippery slippery body fell into his arms and is is amazing. It's the best moment of our lives.
Speaker 1
And so he just passes him through your legs up
Speaker 2
front? Yeah. Yeah. It was really nice. He had lovely color, and he didn't cry right away, but he was he was perfect. He purred purred a little bit. Cute. And, yeah, I just I was expecting the the afterbirth pains. But, again, it took me by surprise how how strong the sensations were.
Speaker 1
And Did they kick in pretty quick?
Speaker 2
They did. Yeah. Yeah. And I just I just kinda wanted to get comfortable, and I I just wanted the placenta out of me. And so I just didn't feel like I was complete. It was beautiful spending a few minutes a few minutes with with Phoenix, and I think Rob had his wits about him enough to take a an an Instagram story.
Speaker 1
Nice. Oh, yeah. I think I saw this.
Speaker 2
That's funny. Yeah. But I just yeah. He's like, babe, so what do you wanna do about the placenta? Do you need anything? He was just being wonderful and caring. And I just slid down to the foot of the bed, squatted over a bowl, and the placenta was born. And Rob just stood there with his mouth open. And I think he said, wow. You just did that like a boss.
Speaker 1
Yeah. It's one of the more badass things I've ever seen. It's just like this the crouching over a
Speaker 2
bowl just being like, boom. Boom. Booyah.
Speaker 1
It's awesome.
Speaker 2
And at this point, I wanna say, reflecting back, I was not ready to have a free birth experience with my first. And so I think it's just super badass and incredible when women find it, you know, that that women who feel that it's that it's the right choice for them for the first birth. That's incredible. But I
Speaker 1
Well, we're all at different we're all at different stages of learning too, and, you know, we all need different lessons, and, I mean, that's really what it comes down to.
Speaker 2
Mhmm. Mhmm.
Speaker 1
Where where was Zion during all of this? Was he sleeping?
Speaker 2
He was with the nanny at the park. Nice. Yeah. Yeah. He's two and a half, and I'm glad that he wasn't around because, I don't I mean, I don't I just either way would have been fine for him, but for me, it was wonderful not to be concerned with his well-being or the way that he's interpreting what's happening
Speaker 1
Of course.
Speaker 2
And be taken out of my my space, my outer space.
Speaker 1
What a cool story. Did you guys plan to do the Insta Stories? How did those things come to be?
Speaker 2
I don't know. I think I think we talked about it briefly, but I'm really glad that Rob we posted them after after the fact. So you know how you can take the Insta Story and then just save it instead of posting it in real time. Mhmm. So we did that. But, yeah, I just I wanted to share a few tidbits of just the raw the raw emotion. And the feedback was was incredible.
Speaker 1
Didn't it get taken down?
Speaker 2
Oh, gosh. Yeah. I chose to forget that part. Yeah. Yeah. I made a snippet, and there's just there was honestly, like, a three second, little clip where I'm in the birthing pool and you can almost not see anything, but you can see part of my nipple and I'm moaning.
Speaker 1
Oh, how dare you?
Speaker 2
And, it's because of that bit that somebody reported it. And, how sad that, how sad that that's offensive?
Speaker 1
Deeply sad. It's crazy. Like, we literally come from this.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah. Especially because I'm pretty sure that somebody who follows you has to report it.
Speaker 1
Yeah. Exactly. I know. It's such a betrayal. It feels so, like, weird. Whereas, you know, c section photos, I mean, they can get you can show some pretty gruesome stuff, and that would not be filtered. But, anyway, conversation for a different day. I mean, really, I just want I know it's only been three weeks. It's nice to talk to you so fresh. And I'm wondering, you know, in these three weeks, just if you can speak to how you've integrated this and how, if at all, if how this has shaped you and changed you and what what it's taught you about yourself or your family or, you know, how maybe how it's affected your marriage? Like, just any kind of just the integration piece of the last three weeks.
Speaker 2
Sure. Sure. Yeah. I think it's really, really neat to to record this at three weeks after birth because it is so fresh. And, I actually prepared a list of ten tips Nice. That I haven't heard, you know, all with one piece as advice for mamas. And, I I think it's a pretty cute list, so I I wanna share it real quick. First of all, get a rocking chair. It's been wonderful to rock with the baby, especially when you're totally delirious in the middle of the night. It's great for, for mama and the baby. And we ordered this awesome little, rocking chair on Amazon. And it's my favorite thing. Favorite piece of furniture in the house. That's for sure. The second tip, is for afterbirth pain because I listen to honestly hundreds of podcast episodes of all kinds and listen to so many birth stories. And for some reason, mamas don't talk about it. Maybe because we forget about it. And since I'm so fresh postpartum, it's still very fresh in my mind. And I've heard that after birth pains after birth pains get worse with every subsequent Yeah. Pregnancy. So it's just nice to
Speaker 1
Your poor tired uterus just gets worse.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I heard that arnica is, great for that. I didn't actually have anything. So I just moaned, moaned through them. But if you can, for anyone listening, do your own research. And, if there's a homeopathic source that you trust, I, I would seriously think about, preparing yourself for that. The third one has to do with Ouchy nipples. And that's another little bit that I feel like mamas forget about because the sore nipples only last, you know, a week or two, and then usually everything is smooth sailing. But just get a good salve. It doesn't have to be necessarily special nipple balm, but a salve that, will be soothing for for your body and maybe even the baby's bottom at the same time is really nice to have. And remember that it's breastfeeding, not nipple feeding. Even though I breastfed Zion for a year and a half and then had a bit of a break, I totally kind of forgot that part with with Phoenix and What do
Speaker 1
you mean?
Speaker 2
Well, it's important for the for the latch for the latch to really get as much boob into the baby's mouth as possible. Mhmm. And so if you don't have, a lactation consultant or a midwife or doula to help out, there's tons of amazing videos on on YouTube even. So I think it's important to to to get, you know, practice getting as much boob as possible, not just your nipple into the baby's mouth. Mhmm. Yeah. And then the I got a milk saver this time, which was really wonderful. Instead of leaking all over the place, there's this really cool plastic sleeve that you can insert into the breast that's not being, that's not the buffet the buffet.
Speaker 1
Mhmm. That's smart.
Speaker 2
Yeah. And you can save save the milk. I didn't have that with Zion, and it was really nice, really nice this time. I didn't even know that that existed, but it was easy to find on Amazon as well. The fourth tip is brainstorm foods to eat with one hand Yeah. And ask friends. And, women who haven't gone through postpartum period themselves, ask why with one hand because you will literally have one hand to do things with. You're always rocking rocking the baby. And it's nice to ask friends and and loved ones ahead of time because when you're freshly postpartum, you're you're vulnerable. You maybe don't even have your wits about you in the same way that you normally do. So ask ahead of time so that people know because asking for help is tough. Mhmm. The fifth one is, I think it's cute. Make a poster. I will ask for help.
Speaker 1
Yeah. Hang it up above your door or something.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Because we as women, in many aspects of our lives don't we don't ask for help. We just power through. And please ask your tribe for help. It really makes a difference, and people just don't know what to do.
Speaker 1
Totally. And what's so crazy is, I think, probably, everybody listening, like, if somebody asked us for help around a new baby, we would be so honored and more than happy to arrange our day so that we could be of service to a new mom who's a dear friend of ours. You know, just like how we show up to baby showers or by registry presence or any of the more, you know, kind of stereotypical ways of supporting, you know, we would really be honored to be asked and yet the idea of asking feels so intrusive and a bother and all of this weird stuff. But the reality is, this is kinda what I fall back to is, if I would be happy to be asked, I better ask. Because I would I would be happy to be asked, and therefore, I can't justify not asking because if they love you, they love this baby. It really is an honor to help each other through this stuff. It feels good for the friend. It feels good for the auntie to be asked and to be included because like you said a lot of people just they don't wanna intrude and they don't wanna I mean the the auntie or the friend they don't exactly know what to do or what would be helpful and it's such a private time, but in other ways they could really use some help and so you know we as the as the women having the babies, you know, we we do have a little bit of the responsibility to use our voice and know that people want to know what to do.
Speaker 2
Yes. Brilliant. Mhmm. Number six on my list is coconut oil. And coconut oil is just so good for everything. It doesn't have to be coconut oil, but oil yourself up and love on yourself. And I just have a tub of coconut oil in in my bathroom, and it's so nice for the baby, for you. And during the pregnancy, we put we give the belly so much love. Mhmm. And then, you know, the baby comes out and we start a lot of us start hating our body right away. Yeah. And it's so sad, you know, our body has this miraculous, yeah, it's it's a miracle. And self care is so important. And when we forget about it, it doesn't have to be anything fancy, but just rubbing yourself lovingly Yeah. Thank you.
Speaker 1
Thank you. That is totally. You know, it's it's, well, I have two different things. One, I was gonna say, what do you recommend for the salves for the nipples? Because I guess they need to be something that the baby can consume because it'll be on your nipples.
Speaker 2
Yeah. I actually got gifted a beautiful salve from a friend, and, I I can't reach it right now from where I am. But I would say, you know, I think it's good not to overthink it, and you can easily do the research. There's so many different ones. Just make sure it's organic and it's Edible. Yeah. Trust your intuition, but the simpler, the better. Nothing with fragrances. Just, you know, that's why I was saying coconut oil.
Speaker 1
Mhmm. And you know, for anyone, yeah, who who doesn't know this, you can after you feed you squeeze out a little drop and rub that breast milk on your own nipple and that can be a salvin and of itself.
Speaker 2
Yes. Beautiful. It's a really
Speaker 1
easy easy, free one to use.
Speaker 2
Mhmm. Number seven is make your space sacred. Make your space beautiful because as a postpartum mom, I mean, now I've spent three weeks, for the most part, in the bedroom where the baby was born, and, you know, the air can get stale and you're crying in here, you're laughing in here, you're just everything is happening in here. And something as simple as a nice smelling candle or some fresh fresh flowers, something, you know, whether you set up an altar or not, that can be just a few objects that bring you back to a sense of peace, a sense of harmony, a sense of sanity.
Speaker 1
Yeah. Oil diffusers or yeah. Fresh
Speaker 2
labs is a
Speaker 1
great idea. Mhmm. Yeah. You inspired me to do a birth altar when we get to the to the house in Maui.
Speaker 2
Oh, that's so exciting. I can't wait to see it.
Speaker 1
Especially because we might be birthing in, like, a Airbnb or, like, a furnished Right. A furnished rental like I don't really know what our situation is gonna be at this point yet so we we aren't gonna probably have like all of our stuff in our little goodies. So that's a big focus of the mother blessing that that I'll be having soon with my sisters is to really create a birth altar that I can put anywhere.
Speaker 2
Oh, that's so great. I'm so happy to hear that. And it's it's lovely to have a visual reminder of the of the sacred, you know, because things can get kind of messy and mundane, and then you're we we are vulnerable in the sense that we are we can be out of touch with that sense of divine Mhmm. Very easily. Totally. Number eight is journal. Even if you don't feel like it, sometimes if you put a pen to a piece of paper and just let it all pour out, It can help deal with fears. It can help integrate whatever birth story you do have, and it helps get a sense of clarity so that you can truly sink into your own experience without other people's other people's stories. Mhmm. Number nine is Soup and Tea, And I highly recommend the book, The First Forty Days. It's so beautiful. Mhmm. I can't remember who it's by, but again, doing a quick Google search, you'll find it. And there's just something so nourishing about hot hot liquids, and I have a background in Ayurveda. So experiencing this this, healing proper these healing properties of soup and tea. I can speak to it from a a different perspective. There's just so much more to it than than nutrition. So what
Speaker 1
Absolutely. And and the author is, I might be pronouncing it wrong, but Heng Oh or Oh? It's h e n g, last name, o u.
Speaker 2
Thank you. Perfect. Yeah. It's a it's a beautiful book, which I didn't read until after the birth, but I wish I read it while I was pregnant. It's a really it's a really beautiful book. And so what I've been doing is, well, soup is self explanatory, but in the evening, I make a big thermos of delicious tea and it's at my bedside for the times that that I would call, you know, all hours of of of morning and night. And it's not really a time when, especially in the first few days or weeks, that you can ask somebody to bring you something Mhmm. You know, or to make you something. So if you make a beautiful tea, maybe with milk or cream or nut milk of your choice, a few teaspoons of coconut oil or whatever other kind of oil, so it's grounding and nourishing and can fill your belly and, yeah, it can be so, so comforting. It's the little things. Mhmm. And last but not least, take your time. I'm already guilty of this. This is three weeks postpartum, and I've been working and cooking and doing all sorts of things. And as you can hear from my raspy voice, I'm a little bit under the weather. Yeah. Take your time. You're not going to recall in twenty years that you made some sort of a deadline, you know, or did all the dishes. You're gonna remember that newborn smell and having the baby on your, at your heart center. That's what you're gonna remember. So cherish, cherish those moments.
Speaker 1
It goes by so fast,
Speaker 2
That's what everyone says. Yeah.
Speaker 1
Right? Like, nobody says, I've never heard anybody say it went by so slow.
Speaker 2
Yeah. For sure. It's a cliche for a reason. Totally. Mhmm. So that's my list. Awesome. I share it from the heart. Just sending so much love to all, all women, all mothers, all men, all fathers, birth workers, anybody listening, thank you for, you know, for being here with us. These conversations are so important. So, so important.
Speaker 1
Yeah. They really are. And they just you know, it feels so good to have a space where we share and celebrate and talk about positive birth stories and power, you know, power stories and birthing and power. And it really it's sad that that feels so radical, but there really isn't a carved out space for that in our default society. So it feels just so important and sacred that you know we we are carrying on the traditions of sharing birth stories and and in this kind of new age, you know, platform of of virtual, you know, audio experience. But to be able to reach, you know, so many people, you know, I know that there's quite a few listeners who have contacted me who are very alone in their journey and who don't have. A supportive community or don't have access to. Non judgmental birth workers or a supportive partner and and things like this podcast are are for some people who have contacted me all that they have so it's so important to share these these stories because at the end of the day, I think I don't remember if we said it when we were already recording or not, but this isn't free birth. This is just birth and yes we want to free birth back into you know it's it's divine form and the only way that I can think of to do that is to not shut up about it.
Speaker 2
Yes. Yes. Yes. Good point. Yes. And I think because most women, unfortunately, do not have empowering births, and whether they realize it or not, they, actually, there's some level of trauma. It makes it harder for Yeah. Those of us who have incredible births to share our stories freely. Exactly.
Speaker 1
I know. It's really sad. We're we're just so socialized to be competitive and to be so honestly narcissistic, you know, that that we're not looking at the whole woven blanket of this. It's really about the one individual experience and and when when the majority of the experience holds so much trauma and sadness or, questioning or, you know, feelings of failure, it's incredibly hard to hold space for the birthing and power stories. But I look at it as like the lighthouses, you know, like these are this is what it could be and it's not easy. You know, all of us who have chosen, these paths of power have had to decondition just like anyone else. Would you know this was not given to us on a on a silver platter? You know like yes, there's privilege involved of course, absolutely and I would never ever deny that but you had to do just as much work as the next person could do.
Speaker 2
Yes. Yes. And I have several girlfriends who are pregnant right now or have had, very traumatic birth experiences. And if any of them are listening or not just my girlfriends, but anybody listening who's had a a traumatic birth or feels like free birth is is not for them, this is just not their cup of tea, We see you. We honor you and and celebrate you. And I just really hope we can all hold space for for each other's stories.
Speaker 1
Yeah. Sadly, that's, like, a really big ask, it seems. But we it can start it can start with us, and we can do it for everybody. Right? I mean, how many stories do we hold that are so different than the paths we would choose? And it doesn't it doesn't bring up all this, like, confrontation within us. You know?
Speaker 2
Mhmm. Well, we're talking about changing an entire paradigm where there's just so many moving parts to this. It's really tough to have a conversation about it when somebody says, well, my baby almost died. Mhmm. You know? Or I almost died, and thank God for for being in a hospital. And what can we say to that? You know? Because you're not gonna you're not gonna say, well, let's rewind and examine all these moving parts.
Speaker 1
I might.
Speaker 2
You will. Yes. Yes. But
Speaker 1
Given the right situation, I would love to dissect that story. But yeah.
Speaker 2
I know. Yeah. It's Yeah.
Speaker 1
Totally. I mean, it's like it's like so many of these systems that people are so devoted to. You know, it's like me telling someone I'm a vegetarian sometimes will will be, you know, met with, well, I would I would die if I didn't have my meat. And it's, like, so intense for them to hear that I'm making a different choice. You know? And and, yeah, those aren't look. But at the end of the day, the people who truly believe that their hospital or their doctor, you know, saved them and therefore and this is the important piece here. And then, therefore, you are irresponsible for not doing the same thing. Those are not our audience. You know? Those are not people that I have much to say to because they're very committed to their story, and that's okay. I can't take that away. That's not my job. You know I honestly, I don't really care like it's it's I guess it makes me sad if I really think about it, but I don't know their story. I don't know their calculations. I don't know what they dealt with. You know. It's that's their story, but I'm interested in working with and talking and exploring with the people who might even have those stories but say and I'm gonna you know I really, I have some questions about it and I'd like to learn more you know and like those are the people like I have women in my free society group on Facebook who are like you know, I've been told that I have to have c sections and that my baby will die if I don't have a c section or I've been told that I can't get pregnant or I've been told I mean so many things you know these women are working out. Their the things they've been told for sometimes multiple decades, you know, and and they come to this space to question it, and to give inquiry to it. And that is my audience. That is who I wanna hang out with. That's who I wanna talk to. Because someone who's willing to question what they've been told you know that's when the magic happens and that's when the power you know starts to get claimed so you know people find us and our job is to to speak and to listen, and and the right audience certainly comes forward.
Speaker 2
Yes. Yes. Yes. Thank you, Emily. Thank you so much. And for, for anyone listening, if you wanna find me, I'm on Instagram at nurturingnova. Feel free to send me a message if there's any way that I can be helpful. I'm here for you. And a bunch of people are asking about my music choices on Instagram. My Spotify is wide open. Search for Katya Nova and enjoy.
Speaker 1
Oh, that's cool. Okay. Great. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, sister.
Speaker 2
Love you so much. Mom. And can't wait to see your story unfold.
Speaker 1
Thank you.
Speaker 2
Take care. Hugs and kisses from across the ocean. Bye. Bye, my love.
Speaker 1
That's it for today, everyone. Join us next week for another episode of the free birth podcast. Thanks for joining us, and remember, your body, your choice. Lots of
Speaker 2
love.
