Speaker 0
Into the wild, I'm going into the wild, I am. It's been a wild freedom child, since I left my roots back home. Into the wild I'm good. Into the wild I am. It's been a while, freedom child, since I left my roots back home.
Speaker 1
Welcome to the Free Birth Society podcast. This is a radical space for women who are ready to celebrate their autonomous choices in birth, motherhood, and beyond. Together, we'll learn about wild birth through personal narrative, we'll explore the politics of birth, and we'll analyze everything that relates to our lives as women from a feminist perspective. Here's your host, Emilee Saldaya.
Speaker 0
It's been a wild freedom since I've left my rules back home.
Speaker 2
If you're like most of my listeners, you are devouring these episodes, fascinated by the women's stories and wondering if you could do this too. Do you wish that you had a step by step strategy for for how to actually plan and manifest your free birth? Our complete guide to free birth is the number one course for free birth, and we made it for women just like you. It's a self guided online intensive course that will teach you everything we think you need to know about how to birth freely and in your power. We'll take you all the way from unpacking industrial care to what DIY prenatal care looks like, how to pick and prep your support team, what to expect, look out for, and how to shift when more support could be needed. Yes. We'll cover the what ifs, how to prevent complications, and how to orient your entire life towards a powerful birth. So head on over to free birth society courses dot com now and take the first step towards the birth of your dreams. This week on the show, we have Sasha, who tells us the story of how she paved the way for the rest of her lineage, how she learned to trust herself and checked herself out of the hospital in labor to have her baby at home. We discussed figuring out breastfeeding, the difficulties that can arise in those early postpartum weeks, and how birthing in power has the ability to end cycles of generational trauma and set a new precedent for all of our sons and daughters.
Speaker 3
Really all started I mean, honestly, I've always been the type of like, in my family, I've always been the one who was just a little off. Like, you always are just doing something that no one in this family does. Uh-huh. So I always knew I wasn't going to give birth in a hospital, but I always thought it was gonna be with a, like, a midwife or a girl. So I was like, okay. Like, I know I'm not gonna be in the hospital. But once I I started following Earth Mama Medicine, and you know her as the lady. So I followed her, like, three, about three years ago. I was looking for I was on my health journey, like, with at vegan, and I was like, I wish I could just find, like, a black woman who is doing the same thing as me so I could, like, connect a little more. And I go on my YouTube one day, and, like, she's on my recommended. And I'm, like, fall in love with her whole, like, everything. And I'm just like, this is what I was asking for. So I follow her up until, today, honestly. So, she and Matt go through their process of, their birth, and they hadn't said that it was a free birth. I just knew it was gonna be a home birth at least. And when they speak about it in one of their, like, question and answer videos, they said they recommended your guys' podcast and, your the course. So I was like, oh, wow. Okay. Like, that sounds dope. Watching her video of, like, at her birth at home, and I was just like, looks so intimate and, like, loving. And I was just like, this is what I need to do. And once I seen that, I wasn't even pregnant. Like, it was just it was probably two months before I knew I was gonna be pregnant. So I was like, oh, this is crazy how that came in. Like, I was already listening to all your stories and then or all the other women's stories. And then I ended up finding out I was pregnant. I was like, well, this is what I'm doing, so I need to buy
Speaker 2
a course. Nice.
Speaker 3
So my mom gifts me the course. Aw. And I was able to go through it. I'm over here, like, listening to everything, getting all the info I need.
Speaker 2
That's so supportive of your mom.
Speaker 3
Yeah. You know, she wasn't it wasn't something she would do. But she was like, well, if you're gonna do it, because I know you wanna do it, at least know everything you need to know.
Speaker 2
Totally.
Speaker 3
And, when I found out I was pregnant, my boyfriend, super ecstatic. He he's never been one for, like, hospitals and doctors either. So it was kind of like a, okay. Like, I know we're not gonna be in the hospital, but he believed we were going to get, like, a midwife or a doula or something because he's he's a first time parent too. So he's like, well, I don't know what to do. Like, as far as he's known, he had his nephew, and they were born he was born in a hospital. So he just knew that setting, and that was a little more comforting, I wanna say. So it was a little tug and pull with the idea of a free birth because it as it normally would, it's gonna bring up some feelings of fear. You know, I started to trust the situation a little more, and I've always been into birth. I've always loved watching birth videos and learning about birth and just it was just so so fascinating to me. So I was already kind of well versed in, like, the what could happen and how to do certain things like this for birth and all this. So I kinda knew a lot more than he did. So I was a little more confident than he was, and I definitely would say that he, yeah, was just a little more fearful. So when the idea of free birth came, he just wasn't completely on board, but I knew that that's what I wanted to do. I'm like, oh, yeah. Like, as long yours as long as you can trust me, my body, and our baby, that's what really matters. Mhmm. And just from past, I feel like, experiences, it was a little harder for him to be like, oh, yeah. I can just fully trust you with that and, like, let go of control.
Speaker 1
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
So that's where, like, the the problems came because
Speaker 1
it was just, like,
Speaker 3
I just if you don't wanna learn it, like, you can look up these things. If you don't wanna learn it and I'm the one learning it, like, you have to trust me. So what
Speaker 2
happened? Did you guys ever get there?
Speaker 3
Like, right before, I feel like giving birth. I we Wow. We got there. But it was, like, the whole time, it was kind of I feel like it was probably, like, very traumatic for both of us. Like, he's just like, okay. I don't fully trust the process, but I kind of have to because you're gonna do it anyway. So it's kinda like forcing him into it. And then me, it's like, this is something that I have to do. Like, I cannot do it with someone. I couldn't even looking back on it, I could not imagine me having a midwife or a doula there with me. Like, it was so raw and vulnerable, like, intimate. Like, I could not have had someone with me, and I thought that's something that I wanted. Oh, my mom or or your mom or our sisters. No. Never. I could not have had that. Like, that would have been the most not even saying it's, like, embarrassing, but it's just, like, it's not something a state that I want anyone to to see me in. Like, I'm glad I didn't even record it because I thought I was gonna wanna record it and look back at it. Yay, Salah. Look at you being more no. Yuck. I don't want you to see that. Like, don't look at me like that. No.
Speaker 1
Oh my god. That's so funny.
Speaker 3
Totally. Yeah.
Speaker 2
Oh, that's funny.
Speaker 3
It's swan tree in there. So But he was there. But he was there every step of the way.
Speaker 2
Just There we go.
Speaker 3
You know, like, trying to do as much as he could. And even when I was just like, please stop asking me questions.
Speaker 2
Totally. I
Speaker 3
can't focus, but he was there. So that's all that matters.
Speaker 2
I'm so impressed with your your just commitment. You know? Like, even it's so hard when the partner doesn't get it or doesn't support it or doesn't trust it, and that's awesome that he came around and was really able to hold that space for you. But, like, so many women use the partner's discomfort. How do I say this? They they they center their partner's comfort and and desires and wants and all of that Mhmm. So much more than they center themselves. And I'm just very impressed that you didn't. You know? Because you do.
Speaker 3
It was pretty hard because, you know, I I went we had, like, really tough, like, conversations because he felt as if I was being selfish, and I was the only one who thought, like, this birth mattered. And I was like, I'm not trying to be selfish. I'm not trying to, like, say f you and your feelings, but I just know that this is the birth that, like, I yearn for. Like, this is, like, this is the birth that my baby is saying. Like, I don't even feel comfortable when I'm walking in the hospital at as a pregnant woman because I did get a little bit of prenatal care, like, in the fur or maybe, like, the second trimester if it was, like, three appointments. But, it's just like I I knew that's not where I was supposed to be, and we didn't have a just amount of money to pay for a midwife or an and a doula. And, you know, I wouldn't wanna shortchange anyone because I feel like their work is definitely worth paying for. It's just not something I was able to afford. So Mhmm. With the cheap way and do it ourselves, you know, at the house. Boom. No medical bills. We're good. So
Speaker 2
So how how did that go in your pregnancy? You said you did a couple of prenatal visits. Like, what was that about? Was there certain things you wanted, or was it, like, just seeing what was out there? Tell me more about your pregnancy.
Speaker 3
Okay. So when we found out, it was more so just going to, like, confirm. Mhmm. I mean, I knew he knew He knew before we even took the pregnancy test. Like, he already had names in his notes because he got like, I think he was pregnant. And he showed me after, like, you know, we had already found out, but I knew. He knew. And we took the test, and it confirmed. So it was just like, oh, okay. That's that. But I guess just to do what every first parent does. I don't know. I didn't really it didn't matter really, but it was it was cool to hear the heartbeat. But all I could think about was, oh my god. Radiation. Oh my god. Totally.
Speaker 2
Like So what happened after you do a couple of them? And tell me about that point where you're like, I'm good.
Speaker 3
It was when so she had, like, a soft marker for Down syndrome, they said. Whatever. And I was just like, okay. What one, I was like, why would you tell a mom that if there's so there's nothing I can do about it. So now I know.
Speaker 2
Of course there is. You can do this test and then this test and then this test and then weekly visits and weekly ultrasounds,
Speaker 3
and
Speaker 2
you can employ the fetal heart medicine doctors and the I mean, it's to tell the mother and get her to be that worried pays so many people's salaries. Yeah.
Speaker 3
I didn't even think about it like that, but that's so true. And I was just like, why would you tell a mom who is creating this child? You're instilling all this anxiety and fear because that's all I was looking up. I'm looking up like, oh my god. Like, does her ultrasound look like she has, like, Down syndrome? Like, what does it
Speaker 2
Because, Sasha, if if you're afraid, if you are in fear, they can control you.
Speaker 3
Mhmm.
Speaker 2
Right? Like, if you're afraid and if you feel doubtful of the of the creature you're growing Yeah. They can get you to do anything.
Speaker 3
Anything. And it was I would always have to center myself and be like, no matter what, the baby is fine. You're not saying anything's wrong with the baby. It's it's just a soft marker. So I was just like, okay. Baby comes out with Down syndrome, then baby comes out with Down syndrome regardless of sale of this baby at home. So it doesn't really matter. So I was just like, okay. Yeah. I had did they had had me come in for, like, one last test. I think I was, like, twenty six weeks. Because, luckily, with COVID, like, my I only had about three, maybe four appointments, and they were so far out that, like, okay. It wasn't even I wasn't getting that. Okay. Come in two weeks. Come Mhmm. The next month. It was just, like, so spaced out. So I was happy about that that I didn't have to go so often. But the last one that I went to was, like, this ultrasound they kept they were like, we didn't get a good X-ray, blah blah blah. And I was like, I don't but it was hard for me because I still couldn't get my voice of saying, like, I don't wanna do this ultrasound, and I feel like y'all are doing it too long. Like, are we done? Like, he would be like, oh, she's just moving around. And at the time, he didn't know the gender, but now knowing, she's moving around. That's a a a clever one or whatever. And I was just like, she doesn't want it. That's why. Ugh. So I was just like, oh my god. Like, I was just, like, saying I'm like, I'm so sorry. I'm trying to get out. I'm trying. And that was, like, feeling so bad, and I was like, I'm never going back. And I never went back after then because I was like, they're for sure not gonna see me in my third trimester try to say something crazy. Oh, you have too much amniotic fluid. We got it. You have the baby out now. And I was like, no. I'm not gonna have anything like that happen. So never went back. And that was pretty much all of my prenatal care. My doctor kept telling me to get the flu shot, and I was like, you know, that's not really what my practice is even without a baby. So it's for sure not gonna be something I do. So weird. Oh my
Speaker 2
god. So did they ever, like, harass you about not coming back?
Speaker 3
No. Thankfully not.
Speaker 2
Thank god. Thank god.
Speaker 3
It was
Speaker 2
Like you did you ever even hear from them again?
Speaker 3
Maybe, like, once in my third trimester, they called. And, honestly, with COVID, they were doing, like, video chat, video chat appointments, and I'm like, okay. What is that? That's nothing. I was Nothing? Yeah. No. You can cancel it. I'm fine. And that was that. So for the prenatal, it was pretty good. I was really chilling. I know at the end, she really started to get really heavy. Like, I'm a small girl. I'm only, like, one eleven. So she I got up to one forty in my pregnancy, and it was all belly.
Speaker 2
I bet. Yeah.
Speaker 3
And I was just like, okay. Yeah. She's weighing real heavy on my on my pelvis here, so, I couldn't really walk towards the end of my pregnancy. Damn. And I live on the third floor of my apartment,
Speaker 1
so that
Speaker 3
was the worst.
Speaker 2
Oh, that's hard.
Speaker 3
Yeah. It was tough because I would be like, I wanna go outside and get some air, get some sunlight, but it's like, I gotta do all this work to walk downstairs. Not happening. So Totally. Did not happen most of the
Speaker 2
time. Stick your head out the window.
Speaker 3
And I didn't even get, like I don't even have direct sunlight in my apartment, so I'm like, oh, great. Like, I'm just feeling hot air. Totally. Sucks. Yes. So, it comes on the Libra full moon, and I wake up, and it's about three AM. And I wake up to, like, a rush, and I'm like, okay. I just wake up again, and I'm like, oh, that typically doesn't happen because what they call the Braxton Hicks, whatever. The those would come, but it would feel like little period cramps, and I'd just be like, okay. Just sit down.
Speaker 2
Totally. And do you know what gestational age you're at with the baby at this point?
Speaker 3
Yes. So I was forty weeks and two three days? Forty weeks and two or three days was one of those.
Speaker 2
And what was your mental or spiritual, like, space heading heading into birth? Knowing you were free birthing, it sounds like you and your partner were, like, all good by then. Mhmm. How was it?
Speaker 3
For my my mind state, it was pretty clear and pretty, like I just knew that this is what I needed to do. So I was really focused on, like, okay. Just listen to your body and, like, just go with the flow. Like, that's what I was just trying to do, just not try to control it myself, you know, and really believe what I'm saying and, like, what I'm trying to practice. So just following that really kind of kept me grounded in it. Nice. But yeah. So they start, and it was probably about fifteen minutes or I can't remember really the time. I wanna say it woke me back up because I tried to go to sleep, but I didn't really look at the time when I woke back up. But I know, like, they didn't stop in my partner. He was, like, on his toes. Like, we were just sleeping on the couch, and he woke up as soon as I woke up, like, is everything okay? And I was like, yeah. Everything's fine. If it if it is starting, I need you to go to sleep because you have to be rested because I'm not gonna be rested. So you go back to sleep. So he goes to sleep, and I just watch a a little interviews about, like, hour and a half. And they're still going, but they're very, like, far and in between. So I'm just, okay, just chilling through it, and then I finally was able to go to sleep about five thirty. So I go back to sleep. I wake up, I wanna say, seven thirty or eight, and they're still going. So I'm like, okay. Yeah. This is, like, we're, like, we're in it now. So it's the beginning of it, and I'm just literally when I wake up, I set everything up so I get some towels because I felt like I was going to give birth in our living room because that's where I was majority of my pregnancy. Like, that's where I felt comfortable. So So I was like, okay. I think it's gonna be in the living room. And, so we set up, like, these towels and everything just preparing for whatever. And going throughout the day, they're getting a little more intense, but nothing too crazy, nothing that it wasn't, able to handle. And I wanna say we come out I took maybe, like, a little nap. And then later that night, my partner comes out from the office, and he's just, like, trying to watch this movie. I think it was, like, Sonic. And we're trying to watch a movie, like, okay. Let's just chill. Who knows? Because I we were prepared for, like, okay. It could be three days. It could be a week. Who knows? So let's just, like, literally chill. My friend had brought over food, so we didn't have to, like, cook or anything. Nice. And I wanna say it was eleven. We're trying to watch the movie, and, like, the rushes got so intense that he was just like, okay. Yeah. Let's turn off the movie because you can't even watch it. So we turned off the movie about, like, eleven, twelve. Oh, I think it was eleven. And I'm just like, okay. Like, I'm really breathing, trying to get through it, and they were intense. And I was like, this isn't even, like, active labor. Like, oh my god. It's gonna get even more. So he's like, can I do anything? Do you need anything? And I'm just like, no. Just just give me some water, please. And I'm just sitting sitting through it, and they started to get longer. They were about, like, two minutes, a minute and a half. So it was just like oh my gosh. Try try not to get the the memories back. But they look really intense, so I'm like, child
Speaker 1
starting to go back
Speaker 2
to You're
Speaker 3
back. I'm like, oh, yeah. I can feel it. So But that's
Speaker 2
My guess is that you didn't have a very long birth then if it was how long was your birth?
Speaker 3
It was twenty seven hours.
Speaker 2
So Yeah.
Speaker 3
Yeah. It was it was about a day and three hours. So we're getting there, and I'm, like, trying. At the time, I'm I'm actually, like, working on a puzzle. So, like, in between the rushes, like, I would just be like, oh, there's that piece.
Speaker 2
That's a good idea. That's a good idea.
Speaker 3
It was I never finished public, by the way.
Speaker 2
Of course not.
Speaker 3
After work, I was like, yeah. Put this public back up. I'm over this. So I'm doing that, and I'm like, okay. Like, maybe trying to find new positions to be a little more comfortable in the rushes. But I had tried standing up, and it was like, woah. No. Sit back down. So sat back down, and then I'm like, okay. Maybe I could try to, like, dance with it, like, flow with it. No. That was even worse. Go ahead and sit back down. What are you trying to do? Because You're like I'm like, oh my god. I'm in pain. Like, it was terrible. So once again, once they really started to pick up, though, I was like, oh, I wanna light a white candle so then, like, you know, I can have her know, like, this is where you're coming, like, kind of symbolizing Yeah. This is where it it kind of felt like it was her with us. So I was just like, yeah. Like, light the candle. And, also, I was telling, like, my mom and my sister and a close friend. I was like, you know, if you guys wanna light the candle so you can spiritually be here too, get a white candle and you can light it and just send me, like, positive energy and good energy and everything. So I had did that as well. And I had so I was going through the rushes, and they were getting pretty intense. So I my partner suggests, like, do you wanna get in the tub? Do you wanna try that? So we fill up the tub. I get in. I bring the candle in there and just turn off the lights so it's, like, a nice, like, orange glow. And I'm just, like, sitting in there, and they made it the water made it a little better, but I feel like it didn't do too much, honestly. So Yeah. I was like, okay. Throughout the time in the in the tub, though, I was kind of like I wouldn't say blacking out, but, like, I was, like, gone. So I would re remember that I would yeah. Like, I remember, okay. As soon as the rush came, like, oh, I'm I'm back into my body. Totally. And then, like, as soon as it was done, gone somewhere else. And, like, that happened that kept happening. I'm like, what time is it? Like, where am I at? Like, it was crazy looking back on it. But then I'm after a while, I'm like, okay. I'm ready to get out this tub. Like, this is doing nothing for me. She's not coming yet. So I get out the tub, and I just get in the towel, and I just lay on my bed. And I'm just and he's, like, laying on the floor on the carpet because he's, like, super tired. So I'm like, okay. Like, I'm trying to see if I'm even progressing because at that time at that moment, I got a little doubtful. And I was like, and my partner's like, do you wanna go to the hospital? Because you kinda like, you're in pain and you kinda don't know what's going on. I don't know what's going on. I don't know how to really, like, assist. Somebody's like, do you wanna go to the hospital? And I'm like, at first, like, of course. I'm like, no. I wouldn't wanna go. And then it starts to set in, and I'm like, do I wanna go? And I text my friend Tiffany because she had just had a baby. And, I'm like, do you know how to check your cervix? I don't know how to check my cervix. And I'm like, wikiHow to check
Speaker 2
how to check your cervix. I'm like,
Speaker 3
I've I'm I didn't know what I was looking for. So I'm like, I don't think anything is dilated. Oh my god. I've been going through this pain. Nothing's dilated. So I'm like, okay. I think I should probably go to the hospital because I was feeling such intense, like, oh my god. This baby's gotta be it's gotta be close. No. And when I obviously, I wasn't cert like, checking correctly. And now knowing the cervix tells you nothing regardless of if you know how to check it or not. You know? It doesn't really matter. So, I've been like, okay. Like, let's just get ready. Let's go to the hospital. So I'm in Ontario, so it's, like, one fifteen minutes away from me. And I'm going we get down the stairs, those three flights, get into the car, and I'm just like, most uncomfortable place to ever be. Oh my god. Never in my life would I do that again. So we're driving. We're trying to get to the hospital. I called them, let them know I'm coming, and then we get there, and it's like a super dead night. Like, nobody's even in there. And I get in. They check they check me in. I lay down, and she puts, like, the doppler on me. And I'm like, do you have to do this? Like, I don't want I really don't want it. And she's like, it's just to check to see how far apart your contractions are and, and the baby's heartbeat. And I was just like, okay. So she tells me that I am my contractions are two to three minutes apart. I already knew that, though. So she checked my cervix, and I was like, are you gonna sweep the membranes? Because I don't want you to do that. And she's like, oh, no. I'm not gonna do that. I'm just checking the cervix. So she, tells me that I'm five centimeters dilated and that I'm in active labor. And I'm like and she's like, do you have a birth plan? And I was like, I just know that I want I don't want an epidural, and I want my baby's placenta to stay attached. I wanna do a lotus birth. And she's like, oh, you're gonna have to ask the physician about that. And I was like, why would I need to ask the physician about anything that's happening regardless? And
Speaker 2
I literally don't know one woman who's ever gotten a lotus birth in the hospital.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And I'm like, why? Why not? What are you guys doing with it? So They sell that shit. Yeah. I'm like, who knows what it's in at this point? So, I don't know, some iron pill in sprouts. But, who knows? But I literally have I tell her that, and she goes and gets the position. Or, actually, no. I tell her first. I'm like, can I go home? Because, like, I just have to sign a paper. Right? And she's like, okay. Let me get the physician. So the physician comes in, and it's me and my partner in the in the room. And she's like, so you wanna go home? Do you guys know like, have you ever delivered a baby? And I'm like, no. But I wanna be at home. Like, I feel comfortable at home. And I'm trying to stay on, like you know, stay respectful towards her just because I've heard of the stories of, like Totally. CPS being called and Oh, yeah. And all these type of things. So I'm just like, I understand your concern. I just feel more comfortable at home, and I would rather go home. So can I sign these papers? And I feel like she was stalling. She just kept asking. And she's looking at my partner. Do you know how to deliver a baby? And he's like What a stupid question. I'm like, the baby's gonna come out regardless if anyone knows how to deliver it.
Speaker 2
Yeah. They they asked me that too. I don't know if you ever heard my birth story, but I Yeah.
Speaker 3
Went to
Speaker 2
the hospital for an exam and then came home. And same thing when I said I was going home, she was like, but have you ever caught a baby before? I'm like, that's not the concern here. It was a weird thing to harp on. She's like, what will you do?
Speaker 3
Like, you
Speaker 2
know women birth at home. Like, I know you know that women birth at home. And
Speaker 3
Oh, ridiculous. I can't believe it. So yes. And so she looks at him, and he's like, no. But I'm I'm not gonna just, like, let anything bad happen. So I got her. She's good. She's saying she wants to go home. So can you get the paper so she can go home?
Speaker 2
So the point where you decided you wanted to go home was just kind of, like, you realize you're fine, and you're looking around, and you're like, this is gonna suck.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And at okay. What the point was I forgot. She had I had asked for water because on the way to the hospital, like, I got extremely dehydrated somehow. So I was just, like, mouth dry. And I'm like, can I have some water? She's like, oh, you're an active labor. We don't give water. I was like, what?
Speaker 2
The fuck out. I was like, I
Speaker 3
can't my my boyfriend looks so crazy. He was like, what? And I was like, yeah. It's time to go. I was like, no. Can I go home? Because I need more.
Speaker 2
Yeah. And this is why these stories are so important for who knows who's gonna hear the story out there on this podcast. And most women obviously don't know what goes on in the hospital when you're in labor, and they don't know how how infantilizing it is Yeah. And how dehumanizing and that they literally don't let you do basic human rights. It's insane.
Speaker 3
I was like, okay. I've heard of food not being available. Like, you can't have food. But water. Like, y'all can't even give me a ice chip? Damn.
Speaker 0
Well, and,
Speaker 2
also, what they don't what most most people are not honest about is they're preparing you for surgery. You know, you have such a high likelihood of surgery now in obstetrics that they are they are evaluating and treating the woman's body because it is a likely surgical candidate. They are evaluating and treating you to prepare you for it. And so, yeah, you can't have a belly full of food and water except, of course, you also can, and they do emergency c sections, and it's fine. But, anyway Yeah. It's really interesting because it's like the the unspoken elephant in the room, but they'll never really say it. Yeah.
Speaker 0
But it
Speaker 2
is what it is. It's why there's so much restriction.
Speaker 3
And see, what I was thinking was, oh, they don't wanna deal with the inconvenience of if you're pushing, you pee or you poop, so they're just
Speaker 2
Well, you would already be on a catheter. If you had gotten to that point, you know, they would have tortured you and broken you down till you had an epidural, and then you would have had a catheter, you know, that was that was Yeah.
Speaker 3
Where your where
Speaker 2
your urine goes. So you have an escape plan, it sounds like.
Speaker 3
Right. So, yeah, one and she did harp on getting an like, an epidural. She asked me twice after I already said in my birth plan that you so you wanted
Speaker 2
to know about. But you're like you're like it's so nuts. Like, in a in some ways, I really wish that women could see the, you know, hundreds of births in the system and see how it goes because it's almost, like, hard to believe that it could be this evil until you're really there. But it's, like, in their minds, it's not a matter of if with the epi. It's a matter of when. Yeah.
Speaker 3
You know?
Speaker 2
And the statistics are, like, less than one or two percent of women birth without it.
Speaker 3
Suck. So, like, basically Yeah. I had a friend who was really trying she was like, I'm not gonna get it. I'm not gonna get it. But they kept saying, do you want it? Do you want it now? You're gonna need it. The endocrinologist is gonna be gone, and you're not gonna be able to get it. And it's just like, why like, she's saying no. Now you're creating that doubt in someone's mind as it Mhmm. Yeah. Do me. Want. It's gonna get worse. I'm, like, it's it makes no sense. It makes no sense. And it's just like well, it makes sense. It's all about money. So it makes sense for them. But it's just
Speaker 2
Well, not just money, but money and control and misogyny. Oh, yeah. You know? And, like, and, like, such a deeply rooted foundational savior complex.
Speaker 3
Mhmm.
Speaker 2
You know? So, like, I know that there are lots of health care workers, you know, in obstetrics who really think they're doing good.
Speaker 3
Yes. Exactly. They think like, no. You need the epidural. It's gonna help you. I'm doing this because I care. And it's just like, one, you're drugging the mother. So she and, like and my friend the baby. So yes. Ugh. That's the main thing. And it's just like, my friend, she was so disheartened because she was just like, I don't even remember. Like, I was so drugged out. Like, I don't even remember, like, what it was like birthing the baby and, like, holding my baby.
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
And it's just like, dude, how do you think that's remotely okay? Like Yeah. How disconnected are we from
Speaker 2
Well, and you really have you have to, on some deep level, believe that we're broken.
Speaker 3
Mhmm. You
Speaker 2
know? Like, you have to believe that we are that women are so sick and incapable and stupid and broken that we require this much intervention and saving. And you you can only do those things and believe it's for the greater good if you believe that
Speaker 3
Yep.
Speaker 2
Which is absolutely nuts. Okay. Tell me about your escape.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So we finally the physician finally is like, okay. I'm not gonna be able to convince this woman. So she's like, okay. Yeah. We'll go get the paper.
Speaker 2
Oh my god.
Speaker 3
And we're waiting. I'm putting my clothes on, and I get dressed. My partner's like, y'all, I think they're stalling because they're taking too long. And he's like, I think they're stalling. I'm like, no. Maybe they're just printing it out. I'm, like, trying to give the benefit of the doubt. And he's like, no. There's no I'm a go tell them to hurry up. So he goes, opens the door. They're literally at the door just talking just to to one another with the paper in the hand, and she just told me I'm in active labor. So it's not like we have this ample amount of time. So he's like and she's like, oh, yeah. Here's your paper. And the head nurse for the night, she had a much better energy, and she was just like, yeah. I can't keep you here. If you wanna go, you can go. Just sign this here. And I I actually still have the paper, so we're gonna get it framed in our daughter's room. And we were like, yeah. We gotta keep this.
Speaker 2
So I
Speaker 3
sign the paper. I get my copy, and we go. And then the rush is, like I I feel like as soon as she said, yeah. You're in active labor. Like, it felt like active labor. I was, like, in pain. So we get to the car. I had, like, a water bottle in the car. I'm like, I chug it, and I'm like, let's go. And we get back to the house, and my rushes are really, like, close together. So I'm trying to get out the car. I have a rush, like, right in front of the garage. So I'm like, okay. Keep walking. After that, trying to get up to the stairs. I have one right before the stairs. So I'm like, okay. Let me time this out perfectly. Mhmm. So I get there, go through the rush. Alright.
Speaker 2
Two hours later.
Speaker 3
Run up the stairs.
Speaker 2
It's hard.
Speaker 3
The door. I get in the house. As soon as I get in the house, another one.
Speaker 2
Totally. Oh my god. That happened to me too. It's
Speaker 3
Like, literally, I'm like, oh my god. I don't have any time. So at this point, I'm, like, bearing down on my boyfriend, and I'm like, oh my gosh. Like, they are taking everything out of me. So I'm like, get into the living room. I'm sitting back down on the couch, and I'm just pushing. And it well, I'm not pushing, but it's like I feel her pressure. And when I look back on it, I feel as if I was kinda I may have been, like, stopping it in a sense. Like, I was kind of stopping her from coming out because my boyfriend was like, shouldn't you be pushing? And I was like, I don't know. I was like, I thought my body would just, like, push her out. And I was feeling, like, some really had like, it was it would be the rush, but there would be some, like, lingering of, like, pelvis pain, like, as if she was, like, trying to come out, and I was the one, like, restricting her. So I was like, oh, okay. So once he said that, it kinda made me be like, okay. Maybe I needed to maybe I really needed to, like, open up. So, I remember going into that mind state, and then that's when I started feeling nauseous. And I was like, I need a bucket. Like, I'm gonna throw up. And then that's when, boom, I puke. And I'm like, oh, I have to pee. I'm, like, pushing, but I'm peeing. And I was like, oh my god. I was like, oh, man. I was like, yeah. I think I have to poop. I'm not pooping in the living room. He's like, if you have to poop, just poop. I'm like, I'm not pooping in the living room. So I'm like, I'm going to the bathroom. I go to the bathroom, and I'm sitting there, and I start to feel my, this is it yeah. I start to feel the sac. So I didn't, my water hadn't broke. So I was just like, okay. There it is. And it felt really weird. It was, like, latex, but hard. And I was like, what
Speaker 2
the heck?
Speaker 3
Yeah. I was like, woah. So it was just, like, a little bubble, and it was kind of up to, like, the first line on my on my index finger that, like, I felt it. So I was like, okay. It's kinda it's kinda getting there. So I'm sitting on the toilet, and I'm just, like, pushing. And I he's like, do you wanna get back in the in the tub? So I'm like, okay. Yeah. Let me get back in the tub. But we had left the water in from the first time, so the water's all super cold. And I have filled that thing up. So I had to wait for it to drain out, and it took forever. It'll say, like, ten minutes. And I'm like, I need to get in that tub. So I was like, you know what? I'm getting in the tub. It was, like, half cold still. I just had on the super hot water. I was like, I'm getting in the tub. So I got in, and I'm like, okay. I'm starting to feel it, and I'm pushing. And I'm telling myself throughout the time while I was, pushing, I'm like, okay. My body is opening. I'm flowing with my body. I trust my body. Because I would notice when I did that, I like, the pain kind of, like, just left out of me. But when I would, like, grit and, like, hold clench my teeth and, like, really just, tighten up, it got extremely worse. So I was like, yeah. I definitely just need to flow with this. Okay? Like, it's coming. And I swear, as soon as I had got the water filled up, like, she was like, okay. Time to come. So I feel the pressure, and the water had broke in the tub. Mhmm. So I was like, oh, she's coming. And I was like, is she coming out of my butt? I was like, oh my god. Like, it's coming. I was like, I don't wanna, what is it? I don't know. I had seen this photo one time, and it was stuck in my head, and I seen, like, a butthole flipped it inside out. And I was like, I don't want that to happen. Oh, yeah. So I, like, pushed my butthole in, and I'm like, no. So I'm pushing, and then she, her head just, like it didn't no. It didn't pop out on the first one. I feel her come down the canal, and then I feel that ring of fire. And I was, oh my god, that was something crazy. I was like, to my as soon as it happened, as I felt it, my eyes, like, bulged. And he's like, what? And he said no words. There is
Speaker 2
no I couldn't even can prepare you for that sensation. I remember being, like when it happened, it was like a marker of where I was like, no one could ever have prepared me for what it is. Really?
Speaker 3
Because I was like, it burns. I was like, oh my gosh. So You
Speaker 2
know what's crazy, though? Some women don't feel that. Yeah.
Speaker 3
That is the luckiest thing I've heard.
Speaker 2
It's wild.
Speaker 3
I Right under on that date of birth. That is the luckiest thing ever.
Speaker 2
Totally. Some women will be like, yeah. I didn't even notice the head come out. Like, that was so awesome.
Speaker 3
The size of the head the size of your vagina? That makes no sense.
Speaker 2
I don't know. It's so interesting how different, but you noticed it.
Speaker 3
Yeah. That name is very accurate. So Exactly. As soon as he looks down, he's like, that's the head. And she had, like, a full head of hair. So he noticed, and I was like, okay. And I knew that you gotta go with the rushes if you don't wanna tear. So I was like, yeah. Fuck that. I'm pushing this baby out. As soon as I felt that ring of fire, I was like, yeah. She gotta get out. I'm not waiting for the next one. So I just I did push against my body. So I pushed, boom, head comes out, and, like, her rest of her body, literally, the next rush, she's just out. Like, nothing. And people were like, really? The shoulders didn't do I was like, no. But now that I think about it, it may have been that little bit of tear that gave me a little bit of give with the shoulders because I was like, I didn't feel those shoulders, girl, but that's probably because the head kinda did all the work. So it was Yeah. So she comes out, and she came underwater, but I lifted her up. And she just gave out, a little a little cry, honestly, just like a little. And then I'm just like, okay. Let me get all the fluid out of her. So I'm just, like, rubbing her back, and I have her, like, little tilted. And I get it all out, and she's just literally just chilling the whole time. And I get her, and I'm holding her. And it was a little like, it was very bloody, the pool. So I was like I said the pool, but the tub. And I'm sitting there, and I was just like, okay. Now let's wait for the placenta. And I was just I was super exhausted. By then, I was like I hadn't slept, so I was just like, oh my gosh. I just wanna get in the bed and go to sleep. So I'm waiting for the placenta to come out. My partner ends up getting in the in the tub with me, and he's holding the baby as well. So I was waiting for the placenta to get out, and then it kind of came out already. Well, while she had came like, when she came out, like, there was a piece of it already out because the quarter's pretty short. So, like, it was, like, a little bit out already. So I was like, okay. That's weird. So I'm just giving it, like, a little tug so it can get ready to, like, come out. And then it eventually just, you know, plops out, and, it was very meaty. I was like, wow. This is this is wild. Like, it was so gorgeous. I
Speaker 2
It's, like, crazier than the baby.
Speaker 3
Yeah. I'm like, look at this thing. Like Yeah. You just you, like, supplied my baby with everything she needed. It was oh, I love that thing. But, so we get that all, and we washed her off a little bit, like, just getting off, like, the blood mainly, but I didn't wanna wash her washer because I know that the vernix is pretty good for their skin. So kept that on, and, I rinsed off a little bit. I feel like I I feel like I did hemorrhage a little. I feel like I lost a lot of blood, and I already was a little bit anemic. So I could feel that I was a little dizzy. So I made sure I ate a little something and drink some water and then just laid down in bed, and we laid down with the baby. I know that it it's so crazy to me because I knew how important the golden hour was, but I did not I didn't do it. I don't know what I feel like like the exhaustion took over, like, my right mind.
Speaker 2
What do you mean you didn't do it?
Speaker 3
So, you know, the golden hour is just holding the baby, getting that skin to skin. The cord was so short, so I initially didn't really hold her. I was having her on my belly, and then, the pool the pool the tub was so bloody. I was just like, I kinda don't wanna be in here. I just wanna be in the bed and hold her. So I was just like, okay. Let me just rinse off and get the placenta out. And I was thinking about the bed so much that I wasn't thinking about, okay. Just get her on your skin. Get that milk supply going. You know? Like, everything that I had been learning and wanting to do this whole time just, like, went out the window. I don't know where it went. So I was like, darn. I didn't get that golden hour, that, like, the prime time. And I it came and bit me in the butt because my supply didn't come until, like, day three. So I had to give her I had found a plant based formula, so I had gave her that because I'm vegan, so I'm raising her as that as well. So, I had to give her a plant based formula, and I was really struggling with my supply. So it that led into postpartum, you know, like, a lot of, lot of problems into postpartum. But after the birth, we kept the placenta on her, of course, and we just literally just laid down in the bed. And she fell asleep after she had ate a little something. And, yeah, that was really I was really I think oh, no. We actually ate some of the placenta. And to this day, my boyfriend's like, that cured my anemia. Like, he used to be freezing cold everywhere. Couldn't even in the summertime, couldn't get in the pool because he'd be like, no. It's too cold when I get out. I can't. Now he's like, dude, I'm hot. Like, I can get in the pool now.
Speaker 2
Like, I can Is he vegan too?
Speaker 3
He's pescatarian. Uh-huh. He's pescatarian. But, yeah, he ate the placenta with me. He did it just raw. I added some honey on there. I wasn't doing that.
Speaker 2
Honey. I've never heard of that. Really? Well, I feel like we gotta get a couple things straight real quick.
Speaker 3
Okay.
Speaker 2
So you you you don't hemorrhage a little. That's not how that's not what hemorrhage is. And so what you just described is definitely within the range of normal, and there's a distinction between bleeding and even feeling like you're bleeding a lot Mhmm. Versus hemorrhage. Hemorrhage is when the body cannot regulate to the point that it it's a combination of of blood loss and how your body and your system deals with that blood loss. So a lot of women will think that they hemorrhaged because they got faint. They got dizzy when they stood up. They even might have fainted.
Speaker 3
Mhmm. And
Speaker 2
then and then, of course, there is some blood loss, but that really is quite a normal immediate postpartum response. And it's one of the reasons, you know, that that it's wise to not move right after the birth, you know, to not stand up, to not be alone, to not so many midwives will will move the woman from water to bed or whatever very, very quickly, And then that will cause a dysregulation, you know, of the blood and the response to the blood. Anyway, so I'm just saying this because, a, you know, I wanna help you kind of Yeah. Add some information to how you process your story.
Speaker 3
Definitely.
Speaker 2
Bleeding and feeling a little bit faint is a very, very normal postpartum response. And we actually know that you didn't hemorrhage at all because then you were fine.
Speaker 3
Got it. Right? Right. Yeah.
Speaker 2
So you can just let that let that story go.
Speaker 3
Boom. Yeah. I couldn't heard it all. I did it like a pro. Oh.
Speaker 2
Yeah. And and you being a little faint and a little maybe shaky or even a little pale or a little out there, as long as that is, you know, temporary and recovering recoverable, then I would absolutely call that a very within the range of normal, you know, response.
Speaker 3
Mhmm.
Speaker 2
Now what's interesting about your story on that note is that if you had been with a medical midwife, she would have immediately gotten you out of the tub, pretty much guaranteed, and she would have done active management of the third stage. So she would have given you a shot of Pitocin and, you know, and then tractioned the the the cord and gotten the placenta out, you know, manually very quickly and and then kind of force of forcibly get you in bed and and, you know, depending on the midwife, get stuff going over there. So, anyway, it's kind of interesting because if you had been with a medical midwife, it's actually possible that that would continue to be your story. And the other thing I wanted to bring up was, your supply, your milk supply, it does come in on the third day. That's for everybody. Everybody gets their milk on the third day. So if there's trauma and a lot of interruption, it might happen later. And, yes, of course, in some cases, it doesn't happen at all, like, with surgical births and a lot of trauma and and intervention. But, yeah, I'm not saying anything is right or wrong about what you did, but but I just wanted you to know and anyone listening to this because I don't want someone to hear, oh, shit. My milk didn't come in for three days. I need to go get formula because that's not true. Right. So I I hear you making that connection between you have some story that you, like, messed up your first hour. Yeah. But and and I know I wasn't there, but I just wanna offer, like, no. You didn't.
Speaker 3
Mhmm.
Speaker 2
You you didn't mess it up at all. Like, you birthed your baby, and then you were super tired and thinking about the bed while you were waiting for your placenta and figuring it out, and you were with your partner. And you of course, you were tending to your baby. So Yeah. I I would I would just offer, like, to also let that story go that you did perfect in your first hour, and nothing about how your first hour went actually Actually from what you've just told me. I know I wasn't there, but none of it sounds disruptive. It sounds very normal. Lots of women are like, alright. Let's get this thing out and go to bed. You know, that's totally normal. But I I I see you making that connection of, oh, I must have done something in that first hour wrong because then it took a couple days for my milk to come in. And this is why it's so important for us to all talk and for women to share because you just kinda made that up or that story was given to you. Right. Because what's actually true, I would say, is that you did everything beautiful and perfect, and most women's milk doesn't come in till the third day.
Speaker 3
Yeah. I I I'm very glad that you said that.
Speaker 2
Yeah.
Speaker 3
So I was beating myself up so much.
Speaker 2
It sounds like it.
Speaker 3
Like, it was very hard on me because I had always had this idea I'm gonna be able to breastfeed and, you know, I'm gonna have that bond with my child. And then when I had to go to a bottle, it kind of, you know, took me back. I was like, this isn't, like, what I expected. And then I was going through a little bit of baby blues, it felt like. Of course. And I felt like I wasn't bonding with the baby. My, luckily, my partner was so involved, and he, you know, he knew his role of, like, I have to make sure you both are okay. So while I'm exhausted and while I'm going through these emotional times, he's picking up, you know, my slack of, okay. Yeah. I can't I can't be with this baby right now, and he's with her a hundred percent. So it was just like and then that kind of also made it hard, like, oh my god. I'm not being a good mother, and I'm not bonding with her. And I felt like I couldn't take care of her, like, for a sense for a moment because I was like, you know, he's doing so well with her. Mhmm. And I feel like I don't know what the hell I'm doing. So,
Speaker 2
you know, you always
Speaker 3
make sure to reassure, like, no. You're figuring it out. I'm figuring it out too. Like, be easy on yourself. It was just so hard, like, to get out of my mind. Sure. Just, like, telling me all the things I don't need to hear, but I'm believing.
Speaker 2
I mean, Sasha, like, give yourself some credit. Like, you you just rewrote so many generations of fucked up birth and disconnect. And, like, of course, our mothers did their best and their our grandmothers did their best, but, like, I don't know your lineage's stories, but I'm assuming they're, like, most peoples Unless you come from a long line of free birtheries. What'd you say?
Speaker 3
I wish. My grandmother literally she was my grandmother, which is my great grandma, and then my granny, is my just grandma, she they both were like, you need to go to the hospital. My grandmother called me stupid. Like, you're stupid.
Speaker 2
Yeah.
Speaker 3
Why are you having a baby at home? And, you know, of course, I know she probably had some fear around it because her mother died in childbirth. So she kind of, you know, probably was very scared and just Well
Speaker 2
and did she die or was she killed? You know? Because that's that's another
Speaker 3
I don't know.
Speaker 2
We don't know. But, like, that's another interesting level.
Speaker 3
Possibility.
Speaker 2
Yeah. It's a it's a high possibility. Yeah. So yourself some credit because there's a couple things happening here. One one big thing is that you, like me and and most women I know, are figuring this out largely on our own. Mhmm. Right? And so there's it it's like fumbly.
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 2
You know? And and that you know, obviously, I'm sure you share this prayer with me. Like, my hope is that when it's our daughter's turn, we're these epic resources. You know? And there's so much rallying around our daughters that we kinda had to carve out and just figure out ourselves. So, you know, part part of why I love your story is that in the midst of you rewriting and, like, claiming and and the tenacity that you have and going back home and just it's such a good story. And there's pieces of it just like with my story too of, like, fuck. We just didn't know. Mhmm. We just didn't know that our milk comes in on the third day or whatever my stuff was with my birth. You know? It's like we only know what we know, and and it's a little fumbly, and and this is why we have to speak. Because someone will hear this podcast now and be like, my milk's gonna come in on the third or fourth day. I don't need a trip. You know?
Speaker 3
And see and the thing is, I I knew that, like, you know, I'm not gonna have breast milk breast milk on the first day. But, like, I maybe it was I didn't know how to get out the cholesterol, but it was just not coming. And I just felt like, oh my god. My baby has to eat. She's gonna starve. What am I gonna do? And there's already this pressure of like, okay. Look. You said you could do a free birth. Don't let anything bad happen to that baby because everybody's gonna say that's how you should do it. You know? Totally. So it's just like that added, like, okay. I gotta make sure I'm doing everything right.
Speaker 2
Pressure. Yeah.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Because I don't want anyone to be able to say, I told you stop. And not saying that they would, but it'd be that, you know, elephant in the room of like, yeah.
Speaker 2
So how how old is your daughter now?
Speaker 3
She is four months. I wanna say she's nineteen weeks. So yeah.
Speaker 2
I love it. You've gotten the weeks.
Speaker 3
Yeah. I am. Every Monday.
Speaker 2
What is breastfeeding like now? How is it how is it for you now?
Speaker 3
It has been a journey. Oh my gosh. So it went from formula and and breast milk once it came in. Then so that was I guess they call that, like, combo feeding. So I was doing that, and then I went to exclusively pumping in the second month. And then from exclusively pumping, there would be times when I would be trying to get her to latch, and she would just not mess with it. Like, not trying to do it. So I tried maybe, like, a nipple shield and no.
Speaker 2
And That's so stressful.
Speaker 3
Yeah. The pumping was oh my gosh. I I just felt so defeated. And I was just like there was many times when I was just like, man, is she just gonna be on formula? Because, like, this pumping is not for me. Like, one, it's just like it stops my whole day. Like, I gotta make sure, sure, okay, every three hours.
Speaker 2
Well, I don't understand why you were pumping.
Speaker 3
I was pumping because she wasn't latching. Gotcha. But I wanted her to have breast milk.
Speaker 2
Of course. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So it was, like, the nipple confusion. You didn't get a solid latch established in those first couple weeks.
Speaker 3
Mhmm. She
Speaker 2
was already getting formula, so it was all, like, weird. So you were pumping to give her the milk. I got it.
Speaker 3
Yes. So she was being she was getting breast milk. I would try to make sure she was only getting breast milk, but there was times when she would have I would have to supplement because I didn't have enough because I wasn't establishing my milk supply either. Mhmm. And now that I know, it was like, Sasha, you really should have been on it because you coulda had this ample supply, but you were, like, one, tired, and you just I was kind of rebelling, I wanna say. Like, I was like, no. I don't wanna pump, but I'm hurting myself. And I'm not necessarily hurting my baby, but I know that I want her to get breast milk. So
Speaker 2
And trying to figure this out on your own.
Speaker 3
Yeah. It was It's hard. It is. Like, motherhood has been kicking my ass. So
Speaker 2
Four months in, you're falling. I
Speaker 3
got a whole lot of
Speaker 1
promise it'll get easier.
Speaker 3
Dang it. So, yeah, it was it was really hard, and I was being really hard on myself. Like, okay. But it was also, like, when you're on social media and you see, oh my god. Eight ounces of breast milk. And I'm like, okay. I only got two ounces out of both boobs. Like, what the heck am I supposed to do? This isn't gonna feed a baby. So I'm getting like, okay. Maybe I just don't have enough. I'm trying to, like, find supplements, herbs, and all these things to, like, kinda boost it, but I don't feel like I was really on it. As much as I was saying I wanted to be, I wasn't doing it. So
Speaker 2
So what's it like now?
Speaker 3
Now I had some random, like, thought in my head. I'm, like, half sleep, half awake. Right? And I'm laying down with my baby because we co sleep. So I'm laying with her, and I'm like, one day, you're just gonna wake up and you're gonna get her to latch. And I was like, wake up that morning. And I'm like, you know what? I'm gonna try to get her on it. She completely latches. Like and I was just like, babe, look. Oh. Yeah. She's on it.
Speaker 1
Oh my god.
Speaker 3
She had she had latched a couple times before, but she would never get back on it. So I was just like, like, this is never ending. But ever literally, since that day, she's just been napping. So we've been obsessed. Breastfeeding now.
Speaker 2
Go, girl.
Speaker 3
And I'm just like, wow. What a blessing. Like, it was so crazy. Awesome. It was so crazy. So, yeah, I'm really happy about that. I feel like she does be talking talking to me. Like, I feel like that was her, like, okay. I'm ready now. Like, you can do it. Totally. That was that. And That's beautiful. It's been it's been really crazy. I know that the bond now I feel between her and I is really, like it's it's becoming exactly what I dreamt of. Mhmm.
Speaker 2
And Also, Sasha, it it took me, like, four months to start feeling it, just so you know. You know? Like, I I didn't realize I didn't realize how bonded I felt until I spent time away from her.
Speaker 3
Mhmm.
Speaker 2
And then I was like, okay. You know, I was, like, creepy and, like, weird. And, like, if she would just be on a walk with my husband or something, when she would come back, I would just, like, need to touch her. Yeah. And I was like, oh, okay. I guess I did love her. I like her. I
Speaker 3
kinda like her.
Speaker 2
Yeah. So, you know, I think, like, my my partner and I framed it as, like because we didn't feel, like, instant love. Like, you know, you see those videos of women, like, crying and being, like, all this stuff.
Speaker 3
And I was like both said that. Not
Speaker 2
me. Yeah.
Speaker 3
We literally were like, I thought I was gonna cry.
Speaker 2
Yeah. We didn't cry. I
Speaker 3
like, he cried when I we thought I was pregnant. And we were like, oh, yeah. This is gonna be emotional. Like, we're gonna be bawling. And we're just like, oh, yeah. The baby.
Speaker 2
We were like for the first eight weeks, we were like, we could give her back. Like, not like we didn't like her or something, but we were just kinda like, I don't know.
Speaker 3
It's not,
Speaker 2
like, that great. Like Oh, fucked up? Yeah. We were not that, like, whatever. Over the moon. I don't I don't like, you know, it's kind of a weird time. Yeah. It's like,
Speaker 3
Your hormones getting back to normal. Yeah.
Speaker 2
It's also strange.
Speaker 3
You know?
Speaker 2
But we we framed it as, like, okay. Maybe it's not about being in love, but it's about falling in love. And that, like, takes time. And Right. That's why the fourth trimester matters because you need to have that time to figure this out and to fall in love and to feel those triumphs and, you know, everything that you just described. So
Speaker 3
Right. I remember hearing your story and being like, okay. And this was before I had the baby, so I was just like, okay. Like, I understand that that's a possibility too. So when I did have that experience, I was like, okay. I could be a little easy on myself because it's not it's not normal, I would say, to just be like, oh, yeah. I just birthed this person. I'm super in love, and I just
Speaker 2
I think it's normal for some people. You know? I think a lot of women have, like, a rush of euphoria and Yeah. Connection and love, but that just I felt euphoric, but not really about the baby. I don't know. It just
Speaker 3
took a while. Yeah. I was just like it's just that different now.
Speaker 2
It's just so unique. You know? It's all, like it's such a spiritual experience, and it just takes the time it takes. And when we when we're, like, relying on Instagram posts and we don't have the village to normalize the wide range of what is normal, you know, it creates that distortion that then we kinda have to just figure out. You know?
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. And I I've realized how, like, important a village is having a child now. And it's like now I knew that I wanted to be a birth keeper, but now it's like when I have my friends and they're giving birth like, my friend actually invited me to her birth because she was able to have two people. Oh, a hospital birth? Yeah. It was well, it was, a birth center, but Mhmm. Potato, potato. So, what's it called? So she invited me there because she was like, you know, I trust you to be there. Unfortunately, she had to have her baby. There was I believe it was preeclampsia, and, she had her baby. So I wasn't able to attend a birth yet, but it's not in the works. One day. Oh, yeah. I feel it. I have, you know, some women who really do trust me. They just not ready to have a baby yet. Totally. And with your
Speaker 2
yeah. With your story, it's it's such a story of, yeah, just, like, badassery and what's possible, and that is undoubtedly going to inspire the women in your community. I'm just so proud of you, and thank you for coming on here and and sharing it with everyone.
Speaker 3
Thank you for inviting me. I feel so honored. Like, I didn't I literally said I wanted my story to be on one of these podcasts one day, and then what? Here I am. So It's
Speaker 2
because you tagged me. You tagged me in your birth photo.
Speaker 3
I had forgotten. Why didn't I tag her?
Speaker 2
Yeah. And I
Speaker 3
go back and I'm like, I hope this doesn't seem weird now. But Yeah.
Speaker 2
No. It caught my eye.
Speaker 1
And I
Speaker 2
was like, oh, it's so cool. Yeah.
Speaker 1
Awesome. That's amazing.
Speaker 3
Thank you so much, friend. Thank you. Have a great day. Thank you so much. I'm very honored to be here.
Speaker 2
And that's it for today, my sisters. Check out everything we do, including one on one and group coaching. Learn about our private membership, in person retreats, and more on free birth society dot com. Our online courses are on free birth society courses dot com, including our flagship course, the complete guide to free birth. Don't miss the radical birth keeper school if you're ready to become the authentic midwife that women are searching for. Together we rise and the revolution starts inside each of us. I'll leave you with our Freebird Society theme song, Wild Woman by Aruba Red.
Speaker 4
I honor you for the wisdom you held, the ancient traditions of plant medicine and womb magic. Magic. I feel the spirit of the ancestors as I place my hands upon my belly. This sacred portal will be honored, eons upon light beams of survival, withstanding, the eradication of our power by design. I will not allow the separation of our young to be forced upon me. My sisters will no longer birth in captivity. The picket line redefined from burning our wild women to paralyzing us and drugging out babes. Strapped down in a clinical white bed, drying up the milk from our breasts, keep your needles. My family will never again be doomed to chase those dragons all your poison. We reject your fear. We choose love, everything with intention. Death, ascension. I will fly and bring her back to the star. Wild woman, she still lives in Sahar.
Speaker 3
Wild woman, from you, I will not hide. They could not burn
