Speaker 0
Into the wild, I'm going into the wild, I am. It's been a wild freedom child, since I left my roots back home. Into the wild I'm good. Into the wild I am. It's been a while, freedom child, since I left my roots back home.
Speaker 1
Welcome to the Free Birth Society podcast. This is a radical space for women who are ready to celebrate their autonomous choices in birth, motherhood, and beyond. Together, we'll learn about wild birth through personal narrative, we'll explore the politics of birth, and we'll analyze everything that relates to our lives as women from a feminist perspective. Here's your host, Emilee Saldaya.
Speaker 0
It's been a wild freedom since I've left my rules back home.
Speaker 2
Is birth work your calling? Do you long to witness and support the awesome power of women as we make life form kinship and transform the world through undisturbed mother centered birth? In your most expansive vision of your life, are you the authentic midwife of your community, walking in total grace, reciprocity, and trust with women through the sacred portal of pregnancy and birth? Then our groundbreaking Radical Birthkeeper School is for you. It's an immersive and intensive, fast paced live program in all things authentic midwifery and self mastery that will give you the blueprint and guidance to launch a life altering, world shaking, radical birth brand and business. Think birth business mastermind, life changing coaching intensive, deep dive into all things birth, step by step road map for serving women authentically, and the wise woman initiation that you have been dreaming of, all rolled into one epic program that will change your entire life. It is time to become the lighthouse that guides women home to themselves. Head over to radical birthkeeper school dot com and grab your spot because we are enrolling now, and we always sell out. Say yes to your calling and join us in this revolution of bringing birth back home. W w w dot radicalbirthkeeperschool dot com. On the show today, we have Alexandra, a solo parent by choice. After finding a sperm donor and just one round of IVF, Alexandra decided to opt out of the medical system entirely despite a highly managed start to her conception and gestation journey. Alexandra shares her story of balancing surrender and control, staying true to her mothering choices, and transitioning into postpartum as a single
Speaker 3
mom.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Just take us to wherever this feels like the beginning for you. And obviously, learning that this is a solo parenting journey by choice. I mean, just take us take us to what brings you into that decision. I don't think I've had a woman, like, that has made that same choice on the podcast yet. So I'm really excited to hear about it even though I I know women who do that. So just take us wherever you wanna start and and start telling us about who you are. Yeah. So I am a single mom by choice.
Speaker 4
So I did go through IVF to get pregnant. I would say that the beginning started. I would go back and forth. So I'm thirty two now. Maybe when I was, like, twenty six, I kept saying, like, I don't really want a partner to have kids. Like, I just want kids. Like, I don't I wanna do it on my own. And I don't really wanna be attached to someone forever because we had kids. I never really saw any relationships that stayed forever. They never worked out forever. So it was like, well, why would I bring children into this situation? And, inevitably, they'll be in the two households, whatever. You know what I mean? And so it was just like, well, why? They can have a, like, a steady household, a peaceful home with just me. And then that was the other thing. I don't really like to compromise. And so it's like, do I wanna vaccinate? Do I not? Do I wanna go to church? Do I not? Mhmm. Do I feel like, I don't know, one parent wants to, I don't know, be Christian and one wants to be, I don't know, any other religion, and we have to argue over that. I don't want that to be a thing. So I'll say this is how I really solidified that I was gonna go down this path. I work for, like, a really huge company. We have, like, huge, like, fulfillment centers or, like, warehouses that we work in. And I was, like, going back just in my head. I wasn't really, like, talking to people about it. And I was walking through our, building one day, and the building's huge, like, eight hundred thousand square feet huge. Hello. So I'm walking through the building, and, again, I'm just going back and forth like, okay. That means I need to use a sperm donor. I have no idea who this person is. Right. I wanted to use a known donor. So those people What do you mean when you say known? A known donor is someone you actually know. So
Speaker 2
Oh, like, in real life?
Speaker 4
Yes. In real life. And and it can vary. So some people use known donors like your best friend that just wants to be helpful to you, an x. Also, people find known donors on Facebook pages.
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
And so there are Facebook groups for known donors, and they meet up, they exchange the sample, and then that's it.
Speaker 2
So known implies, outside of a bank?
Speaker 4
Known yes. So outside of a bank, because with, like, traditional cryobanks, there's a few different types of donors. So you can have an anonymous donor. Right. So you would most likely see, childhood pictures of that donor, and then you can have an open ID donor. And I might get these mixed up, open ID and ID disclosure. So an open ID donor, I believe, is a donor who is willing to have the child reach out to the cryobank. The cryobank will then reach out to the donor when that child turns eighteen.
Speaker 3
Wow.
Speaker 4
And if they wanna know each other, if they wanna meet up, they can. And ID disclosure donor means that at eighteen, the child can reach out to the cryobank and all the information that the cryobank has so that, like, the donor's current address, any information that the cryobank knows can be given to the child. And so I have an ID disclosure donor. I didn't wanna take that opportunity away from them if they feel like they did wanna know who that person is in the future.
Speaker 0
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
So, yeah. So that's the difference between, like, a cryobank donor and then a known donor. And the the other part of having a known donor is, especially if you do, like, natural insemination, which means you just have sex, you know, That donor oftentimes can have parental rights so they can change their mind. Yeah. And and it kind of defeats the entire purpose of being a single single parent by choice. You pretty much say you can come back at any time and try to get parental rights. It's scary. Oh my god. I thought about using, like, an x. Mhmm. Because because you wanna know, like, at the time, this was more important to me. Like, I know what he laughs at. I know what he thinks is funny. I know what foods he likes. You know what I mean? And then you're like, oh, you see it in your kid and you know, like, where they get it from. But then it became not as important to me. You know what I mean? And so that's why I went with a cryo bank.
Speaker 2
So you went with bank because that gave you the most control?
Speaker 4
Yes.
Speaker 2
And then you chose ID disclosure in case your child at eighteen or or beyond wants to explore a potential con path of contact.
Speaker 4
Yes. Yeah. And it's really funny because so we're actually in contact with her donor siblings. We have a Facebook group. Yeah.
Speaker 2
Okay.
Speaker 4
So it's like a bunch of women that have kids by the same man. Mhmm. And she's, like, of the older group of kids. He donated. We got his, sample and pretty much got we all got pregnant last year in twenty twenty. So why was he so popular? He was such a cute little kid.
Speaker 2
So you only saw pictures of him as a child, or do you see pictures of him as an adult as well?
Speaker 4
Well, so you're talking to an FBI agent. Not really. But I found him in real life.
Speaker 2
Of course.
Speaker 4
But I didn't find him until I was pregnant, so there was, like, no going back.
Speaker 2
Okay. Interesting.
Speaker 4
Yeah. So we have a Facebook group. I think there's, like, five of us right now.
Speaker 3
Woah.
Speaker 4
Yeah. And so, like I said, she's, like, in the older group of kids because I'm sure more will come later. And, like, I was concerned, like because you're gonna get to know these kids. They're, like, your siblings, your half siblings. And if the eighteen year olds reach out to the donor and meet him, and then there's a ten year old Right. Like, how does that work? You know?
Speaker 2
Mhmm. Wow. Yeah. A whole different can of worms there.
Speaker 4
Yeah.
Speaker 2
Uh-huh. Well, I mean, if you're choosing to be involved with the group, like, you could you could
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. Opt out. Just not yeah. So, actually, there's a donor sibling registry on California Cryobank, which is the Cryobank I used. And we registered our children's births, so you can log in to that and see how many donor siblings there are. And so some people are in the Facebook group, but not registered on the sibling registry. Some people are in the sibling registry and not in the Facebook group. And so, I know one for sure is in the sibling registry, but not has not interacted with us at all on the Facebook group. So, yeah, people choose not to join.
Speaker 2
Totally. So forgive my ignorance, but okay. So with the guy who who donates his sperm, does he, like, does he get does he just have, like, a ton of batches?
Speaker 4
He has a few, I think they're called releases. Like, they do a oh, he'll have a release in November or something like that. I think that's what it's called.
Speaker 2
Some graphic. I mean, that's, like, a perfect name.
Speaker 4
And there's, like, a bunch of vials. Yeah. So so I'll tell you, like, mine. I purchased two vials.
Speaker 2
Okay.
Speaker 4
I did IVF. Wow. Good odds. Right. And from my IVF okay. Are you familiar with IVF at all?
Speaker 2
Yeah.
Speaker 4
Okay. So from IVF, you know, you can, you'll get embryos, and then some people test their embryos for PGS testing. And so after PGS testing, I had fifteen embryos. So Woah. Yeah. Like
Speaker 2
And where are those now?
Speaker 4
Frozen in Virginia Beach.
Speaker 2
And are those yours? Like, do
Speaker 4
you Yes.
Speaker 2
Own them? Okay. Yep. Okay. And you paid and have them stored?
Speaker 4
Yes. Okay. Whoo. This is crazy. And, actually, my company has a benefit called Progyny, which I wish more companies had. It's so helpful. And they actually paid for a year of embryo storage, which at my clinic is about nine hundred dollars. So and it's not bad overall.
Speaker 2
Shadow side to that is because I'm I'm familiar with with with companies like Facebook and and other companies that also offer, egg freezing support. I don't know what it's really supposed to be what, like, the correct term is, but I think kind of the the shadow side to that also is the incentive the incentive to work Yeah. And just have babies later.
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. Which I guess,
Speaker 2
I mean, women should decide to to
Speaker 4
Because you you'll preserve your fertility. Yeah. So you can do this at thirty and then wait till thirty five, thirty seven, thirty eight.
Speaker 2
Wow. Okay. Crazy. Okay. So you had so many successful embryos. I mean, that's, like, that's a lot.
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. Like so at my clinic, we kind of do our, IVF cycle in batches, and so you don't really see anyone, and it was during COVID. So we were all, like, separated.
Speaker 0
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
But you kind of knew, like, everyone was coming in for day one. What is it? I can't even remember. Like, testing pretty much.
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
And the embryologist called me once the embryo got to day five, and she's like, you were my first call. I couldn't wait to call you. You had so many embryos. And I'm like, oh. And you just don't think about this side. I never thought about this side. I chose to be a single mom by choice, and then I said, I'll do IVF because I want my child to have siblings. And you kind of get, like, cycles and progeny, an IUI, which which is an intrauterine insemination where you pretty much put a vial of sperm in your vagina.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Why didn't you do that one?
Speaker 4
Less control.
Speaker 2
Okay.
Speaker 4
So, I kind of wanted to choose gender. I wanted to do testing, like, chromosome testing, and I couldn't do that with an IUI. And then, again, they're nine hundred to a thousand dollars per vial. Mhmm. And so oftentimes, you could do four IUIs before you get pregnant. So that's almost four thousand dollars. So you chose sex.
Speaker 2
You chose which embryo
Speaker 4
Yes.
Speaker 2
Because the embryos are sexed.
Speaker 4
Yes.
Speaker 2
Wow. Okay. I haven't thought about this in a little while. Okay. So the embryos are sexed and you can do genetic testing on them prior to insemination? Yes. Wow. Okay. So you were like, I want a girl? Yes. And you had incredibly fertile odds.
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. Wow. And okay.
Speaker 2
This is terrible, but I'm really thinking, like, damn. I wonder if you and this guy, like, met. Like, you would be very fertile together. Like, have you had this thought?
Speaker 4
So they they say that and, like, you hear all these, I don't know, wives' tales, whatever, in these fertility groups and people on by choice groups. And so they say the more genetically different you are, the higher your odds are of, like Oh, okay. Like, fertility or something like that. So if I would have chose, like, I guess, like, a black African American guy, I don't know, Maybe the odds would have been lower, but I was eliminating certain things. And so he's biracial.
Speaker 2
Okay.
Speaker 4
But I was trying to eliminate, like, sickle cell Yeah. Sickle cell trait, stuff like that. And that was so he had a cute picture. At the top of the page when you click on the profile, there will be, like, a link where it says sign form if the donor has, some genetic disorder that you have to sign off acknowledging. And so the second thing I noticed was that he did not have that sign off thing. And so that was another thing. I didn't want a donor that I had to sign off on. Of course. Right. So that was the second thing. Yeah. And so that's kinda how I chose him. And I almost didn't get the vial. How did so I called so I logged in one day, I think, like, maybe February, March last year, and I saw his his profile. I I saw that it was, like, no sign off, And I'm like, oh my gosh. I I really need to get these vials. And it just said low vial count. Usually, it says thirty vials, twenty six vials.
Speaker 2
It just said low vials. After him.
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. Well, just for all of the donors, it'll tell, like, the actual number. You know? And his just said low vials. So I'm like, okay. I called my mom. I'm like, this this guy is really cute. I think that I wanna get the vials. And she's like, we'll go ahead and get it. I said, I think I'm gonna hold off. Sorry. I called California Cryobank first, and the agent told me they're so helpful. They're so nice. The agent told me, I think that you should put some on hold because they could be gone by tomorrow.
Speaker 3
Mhmm. So
Speaker 4
I said, okay. I'll put them on a a twenty four hour hold. It's a free hold. You just come back tomorrow and let us know whether yeah. Come back tomorrow and let us know whether you want them or not. Called my mom. She said, I think you should get them. Called back the next day because I'm like, I'm still gonna think about it a little bit. And there were eight vials when I called the previous day. When I called back, my two were the only ones still there. Woah. Yeah.
Speaker 2
Because he was in high demand.
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Mhmm. Yeah. So yeah. So it was a combination of so I was walking through my building at work, and I found a key chain that had a sperm and an egg on it.
Speaker 2
You just stumbled upon this key chain of a sperm and an egg? Yes.
Speaker 4
And it said cryobank on it or, like, cryos or something like yeah. So I'm like, this is my sign that, like, this is what I should be doing in that eight hundred thousand square foot building. You know?
Speaker 2
Wow. I mean,
Speaker 4
what are
Speaker 2
the chances?
Speaker 4
Right. And then the second side of my sign was, so I got pregnant in October of two thousand nineteen, like, by an ex. Yes. I had a miscarriage.
Speaker 2
Okay.
Speaker 4
And I was in denial. I'm like, it's a stealth pregnancy. I'm pregnant. I'm I just I don't know. I'm not showing. And that lasted it was, like, on and off. Like, I believed it sometimes. I didn't believe it other times.
Speaker 2
So how far along were you with that one
Speaker 4
when it Very early. Like, six weeks, five weeks, something like that. And so I think by January, I hadn't had a period for, like, forty like, no bleeding for over forty days or something like that. So I went to the doctor. I was misdiagnosed with PCOS, and this leads into how I had so many embryos. Misdiagnosed with PCOS, and that's what jump started me. Like, I need to get this going right now because
Speaker 3
I
Speaker 4
don't know what my fertility will look like. You know? So that's when I started looking into Progyny through my my, job and started everything. Well, I go to the reproductive endocrinologist, my RE, and she's like, you don't have PCOS. Like, your hormones are fine. You do have PCO, though. And I'm like, well, what's PCO? She's like, polycystic ovary polycystic ovaries. And that just means you have a lot of follicle, so you you create a lot of eggs. So, yes, you're not problem. No. Yeah. Okay. So you
Speaker 2
get pregnant with super ease. This is last year during COVID
Speaker 4
Yes.
Speaker 2
Twenty twenty.
Speaker 4
So my transfer was in July.
Speaker 2
So I am so excited to hear about how you start with this, like, hypermedical, hyper controlled story and then wind up in a freaking free birth. So tell us what walk us through that arc.
Speaker 4
Right. So when I was getting pregnant, I would often listen to anything about pregnancy, birth, single mom by choice podcast. And so I came across the podcast, and even before I got pregnant, I said I wanna have a free birth.
Speaker 0
Why?
Speaker 4
Yeah. Why?
Speaker 2
It just seems so it's very unusual for women who start that medical to not wind up with a highly medicalized birth.
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2
So this is definitely very, very, yeah, unique. So tell me So
Speaker 4
some things that went into it, the black maternal mortality rate, I did not want to be I didn't want a bunch of interventions. I didn't want a bunch of scare tactics. None of it. So it was just like I
Speaker 3
mean, I'm
Speaker 4
just pretty
Speaker 2
sure right there.
Speaker 4
Yeah. Yeah. That's enough. Oftentimes, IVF pregnancies or IVF babies have heart issues. So I pretty much stayed within OB until, I think, around, like, twenty ish weeks, you get an ultrasound where you where you make sure, like, everything's okay with the heart. After that, I never went back. So they Oh. They told me that I needed to come back to do my glucose test. And right there, I asked, is there any alternative that I can do aside from that drink? I don't wanna have the drink. And they're like, oh, well, only if you've had gastric bypass or any type of gastric surgery can you do any alternative. I said, okay. Like, no argument. I'm just not even gonna get into it because at the end of the day, I can make my own decisions. You know?
Speaker 2
I also love how illegal it really is. Like, it's, like, completely against the oaths that doctors take to not name that the alternative is to just not do it. Yeah.
Speaker 4
You don't have to do it.
Speaker 2
You don't have to do it, but they're never gonna say that.
Speaker 4
And so so I'll say I teetered back and forth between, like, just completely, like, wild birth, free birth, and, like, do I need to to test my glucose? You know? Or do I need certain things? And I'm really grateful I, met up with a midwife who supports free birth in Virginia. She's in Charlottesville. And I'm like, can you please explain to me why it's always said that minorities most likely have gestational diabetes. And I'm glad that she was okay with saying they save minority because they really mean poor. Like, that's what they mean. They mean you you don't have access to the best food choices, and so you're already set up on a path towards diabetes. You know what I mean? Mhmm. And so I'm like, okay. Well, I eat pretty healthy. So I'll test my glucose. If it even seems crate crazy slightly, then I'll pay more attention to it. But it was perfectly fine. I tested for, like, four days, and it was perfectly fine. Mhmm. After that, like I said, I never went back to the doctor. And a part of what I didn't really like about them is, like, I think there were, like, eight delivering physicians, and they wanted me to see all of them during my pregnancy, which means I don't really know any of them. Like, I'm seeing you one time because I go every four weeks. It it just didn't seem like something I wanted to do. So I didn't say anything. I didn't register to give birth, and I did think in the back of my mind, okay. If you choose to go to the hospital, you're just gonna make this process even worse because then you're gonna have to do all the registration and all this stuff. But I'm like, I'm just gonna be headstrong. I'm not gonna do it. I'm there should be nothing wrong. So
Speaker 2
And it's a fine line, I think, to walk for all of us who who choose to birth outside of the system of, like, how much on your radar do you wanna get on their radar to, like you said, like, maybe register or something versus nothing at all.
Speaker 4
I honestly thought that they would reach out because I've heard stories that they would reach out telling me, hey. We haven't seen you in a while. Do you wanna go and schedule an appointment? Right.
Speaker 0
Yeah.
Speaker 4
They never reached out. Yeah. Like, closer to the end of my pregnancy, I'm in a free birth group on Facebook, and so they kinda tell you, like, some of the supplies you need. Some people are very minimal, and they don't get anything. I got, like, a birthing pool. I got some Chucks pads. I think I got I wanted her to have, like, specific, scissors to cut her umbilical cord that she can keep, like, that were hers.
Speaker 2
Aw. That's cute.
Speaker 4
Yeah. So I got those things. And then I think that was pretty much it.
Speaker 2
Who's gonna be there? My mom.
Speaker 4
And, initially, my mom was not really on board with, a free birth. She had all of her births in the hospital. Yeah. But she did have all natural births, And so she kind of knew, like, what to expect as far as that goes. But she was curious, like, well, what about the vitamin k shot after she's born? What about the erythromycin that goes in the eyes, stuff like that? I was like, none of it is really necessary, so it doesn't matter. And so I told her, like, you really need to educate yourself. If you're going to be afraid, you can't be there. You know? And so she did. She educated herself. And I actually told she lives, like, two hours away, and I told her, I kinda wanna give birth by myself. And she was just like, I don't think that's what you want. I'm like, no. I I think that I kinda wanna give birth by myself. And I'm like, I think that I might tell you closer to the end of labor, and then once you get there, maybe you'll walk in right after I deliver. But she did end up coming down, and she was there for the entire birth. And even after the fact, I think I think that I would have been okay giving birth by myself.
Speaker 2
Of course.
Speaker 4
I think and she even says, like, you were very, like, independent. I would try and help you, and you didn't really want help. I'm like, yeah. I it didn't seem, like, crazy to me. You know what I mean? It seemed very doable. And so I started my maternity leave around, like, thirty six, thirty four weeks, something like that. And I was just waiting and waiting and waiting and waiting, and nothing was happening. And so I know some people are scared of castor oil and but I was like, I'm gonna try. So I tried that, and it was, like, nine or ten o'clock at night. The next morning is when, like, contractions really started, and I didn't give I was in labor for about seventeen hours, and everything was, like, I was documenting things, so, like, making, like, short clips and videos. Mhmm. And I'm I'm assuming I had back labor. The only pain was, like, right in the middle of the small of my back. Like, I didn't really feel anything in the in the front of my stomach or, like, what people would describe, like, traditional contractions as. And so I wasn't at first, I wasn't sure that I was even in labor. I wasn't sure what it was. Mhmm. But I was just hoping like, okay. Maybe this will die down, and it didn't really die down. Just kept going and kept going and kept going. And so I think around midnight is when it got to a point where it was just, like, uncontrollable pushing. So I labored all that day. Around midnight is when I knew I wanted, fetal ejection reflex to kind of do its thing just because I wanted to experience it. And I don't I'm not really sure if that's what what happened. You know? But, around midnight, twelve thirty is when it was just, like, uncontrollable.
Speaker 2
Is your mom here yet?
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. She's here. She's
Speaker 2
here. Okay.
Speaker 4
Yep. And I actually had to, like, kick her in my my mom's dog. And I'm like, you guys have to go.
Speaker 2
So are you just, like, completely fearless?
Speaker 4
I didn't I just I didn't think anything was gonna happen. Anything bad was gonna happen. It was just like, this is normal. Uh-huh. We'll wait to see how it goes, and then yeah. I I I don't wanna fear that.
Speaker 2
I'm so impressed because they're so I say this with total, like, love and respect, but you obviously have a control freak side, you know, and, like, most of us do. And it's it's like a phenomenon that you also have so much confidence in, like, in internal resource ness that you could also just let go and give birth. Like, a lot of women who have the strong type a thing have a really hard time in labor because it requires so much freaking surrender. It's like the antithesis to control. Right? Yeah. So I'm just very impressed that you, like Well,
Speaker 0
it's
Speaker 2
all to kind of juggle all of it.
Speaker 4
Yeah. So it's really funny because, like I said, I recorded a lot of it.
Speaker 2
Uh-huh.
Speaker 4
And I remember, like, putting my like, feeling inside my vagina, and, of course, I'm not getting cervical checks. I don't even know what one or five or whatever centimeters might feel like if I'm doing the check on my own. And I'm telling my mom, like, I don't know if it's open enough. Like, I don't know. Like and I'm, like, logically thinking. Like, I don't know if it's open, like, wide enough. I don't know. And I remember the midwife telling me, like, well, you can't really have, like, intellectual conversation if you kinda want the FER to kick in. Like, you kinda just need to be very primal and, like, let things happen on their own. And I'm like, well, I'm, like, analyzing all of this, so maybe I should just have them leave. And that's when that was. I was like, I think you guys should, like, just let me do this by myself. Like, I don't wanna have to think about anything. And that's when I think after I let them back in after probably, like, an hour is the that
Speaker 2
you're referring to them as them. The dog the dog and the human.
Speaker 4
Yes. My mom and the dog because I have pictures. The dog was, like, right next to me, right under me the entire time.
Speaker 2
That's funny. So you noticed, like, a shift when they left where it was
Speaker 4
just like yeah. Yes. And things, like, I feel like started to move. And, again, I could and my water had not broken yet, so everything was still, like, intact. I was even at, like, I'll say maybe, like, ten o'clock at night. So I gave birth at twelve fifty three. Maybe, like, ten o'clock at night. I'm still like, is this labor, though? Like, are we sure? You know? And so You're just built for this, girlfriend.
Speaker 2
It's awesome. You just got pregnant. Crazy. And and yeah. It's beautiful.
Speaker 4
So at, like, twelve fifty three, like I said, I gave birth, and I was I did not wanna tear. And so I'm like, I'm holding my perineum as I'm, like, letting the head come out. And my mom had looked to see I'm like, does she have hair? And she's like, she has hair. I'm like, okay. So I'm like, feeling down there, and, eventually, I'm just like, the head's out. And she's like, what? What do you mean? So she looks. She's like, the head's out. And I'm like, I know the head's out. You know? And I know that once the head comes out, like, you're supposed this is all stuff again, like you said, education from Facebook. But then, like, the baby's supposed to, like, turn and then the the whole body will come out. Mhmm. So I was unsure whether the entire head was out. I could feel, like, the the smooth back of her head in the front, and then in the back, it just felt like a bunch of ripples.
Speaker 2
Totally.
Speaker 4
So I'm like, I don't know if any of these ripples is her chin, like, saying every like, her entire head is out. So I gave, like, a tiny little push, like, to make sure everything was out, and her entire body came out. Mhmm. And her cord was wrapped around, so she had a nuchal cord, like a double wrap around her neck, and I just unwrapped it. And I think I was just, like, in complete shock. I couldn't even believe. Like, it's over. Like, this is it. And I'm I was just, like, so grateful. I know I I just did not wanna transfer to a hospital. I and I never felt like it got to the point actually, that's a lie. I remember saying I remember saying just call nine one one. Take me in. Take me in. They can give me a c section. Oh, no. And this was, like, right like, I I think I was just, like, so scared. I could still her head, like, right on the other side of my vagina. I'm like, I have no idea what this is about to feel like. This is what people are, like, screaming at in movies Mhmm. And it's about to happen to me. You know?
Speaker 2
And your mom was just like, okay, sweetie.
Speaker 4
She was just like, Zan oh, so she calls me Zan.
Speaker 3
Uh-huh.
Speaker 4
But, she's like, at this point, they're gonna make you deliver her anyway. Like, she's so far down. She they're not gonna give you a c section. And that was, like, the only thing that, like, calmed me. I'm like, oh, yeah. I'm too far.
Speaker 2
It to win it now.
Speaker 4
Yeah. And I will say, pushing her out was not painful for me at all. The contractions were painful. And if you have one really intense contraction, I feel like it's very doable. I think the part that makes it, like, okay. Can this be over with is the fact that it keeps coming and keeps coming and keeps coming. You know? Like, it's just hours of it. It just doesn't stop. But the pushing was I was I'll say I was very shocked.
Speaker 2
Nice.
Speaker 4
Yeah.
Speaker 2
Cool. Mhmm. Beautiful. I'm blown away that you didn't, like, feel so
Speaker 4
I was waiting for the ring of fire. Didn't have
Speaker 2
it. Sweet. That's awesome.
Speaker 4
Not that I know.
Speaker 2
Did you tear at all?
Speaker 4
So I saw, like, bright red drops of blood coming out, which I I believed was a sign that I was tearing. I didn't have any pain in my vagina, so I I don't think I tore. But then I did, like, a few weeks later okay. Good. Yeah. So I didn't have any tearing. And then, like, a few weeks later, I did get, like, granulated tissue near my perineum, which, again, makes me think I might have torn or maybe it was a stretch or something, but it was nothing like I expected it to be.
Speaker 2
I mean, if you if you tore, it would burn when you peed.
Speaker 4
No. And I was really scared of that. Like, my first pee, I almost and then your your bladder holds, like, a normal amount of pee almost immediately. Well, at least mine did. It went from, like, two ounces to, like, a gallon of pee. And I was, like, running to the bathroom, trying to get the peri bottle together. I'm like, I can't do this. I can't touch warm water when I have to pee. I'm gonna pee on myself. So my running to the bathroom, so scared that it's gonna burn.
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
And then there was just no burning. And so I'm like
Speaker 2
Awesome. So what about the placenta? And what position are you birthing her in? Are you I'm picturing you, like, on your knees?
Speaker 4
Yeah. So almost like almost like when someone proposes, like, they get down on one knee.
Speaker 0
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
And I wanted to be in the pool. I'll say that's how I let go. Like, I was very, like, I'm gonna be in the pool. I'm gonna give birth here. I'm gonna do this. And it was just like, no. I'll I'll even say I had to get out of the pool because the water got too cold. Mhmm. And then my mom wanted me, like, to, like, kind of relax and everything and get back in the pool, and I'm like, I don't really wanna be in the pool. She warmed the water up. I didn't wanna be in the pool because the pool was too, cold. Sorry. So she warmed the water up, and then it was too hot, and I got, like, really, like, light headed. Yeah. So then I just got out, and that's when I was, like, in the kneeling position. And so I really wanted to encapsulate my placenta. So we kinda let I let the umbilical cord stay on for maybe, like, twenty minutes. I think we're, like, twenty minutes, cut the cord, and I completely forgot about the placenta. I took a shower. Wait. What? Like, after like, after like, I left it there in a bowl.
Speaker 2
Oh, like, you birthed it?
Speaker 4
Yes. Yes. Yes.
Speaker 3
I
Speaker 2
thought you meant, like, you forgot about it inside of you. I was like, wait. Wait.
Speaker 4
No. The placenta came out almost immediately also.
Speaker 2
And it's in the bowl. Cut. Yes. Now you're free. You go take shower.
Speaker 4
Yes. I go take a shower, and I forgot it, like, overnight out. And and so I'm like, can't really encapsulate at this point. But, yeah, the and the placenta came out easier and faster than I thought it would also. So Beautiful. I think I was still in the kneeling position, like, just, like, in awe. And I'm like, oh, the placenta is coming out. You know?
Speaker 2
So awesome. Yeah. Cool, calm, and collected. That's you. You're three months postpartum?
Speaker 4
Yes. You said?
Speaker 2
Yeah. So how has this been? Solo parenting, your mom lives two hours away. So what what does the next twelve weeks look like for you? How's your body? How's breastfeeding going? You're, gonna go back to work at some point, I assume. So, yeah, what is all that like?
Speaker 4
So I go back to work in August, but postpartum, I feel it was postpartum is intense. Like, of course, your body doesn't look normal, but I I feel like that stuff can come in like, you'll get back to normal eventually, and I wasn't really focused on that. I'll say breastfeeding was probably the most difficult thing for me. I felt like there was nerve pain in my neck when she would latch, and I would have scabs, like, covering my nipples. No. Yes. It was horrible for me. So but, eventually, we moved past that. So I'm I'm asking my mom, like, how long does this last? I contact a a lactation consultant. And, again and so I so I again, so I did IVF very medicalized, kind of, like, moved out of that to deliver very, like, free birth. And then I felt like I gave birth, and I moved back to that, like, the medical side almost. And I was getting frustrated with myself because it was like, okay. Contact the lactation consultant. Then the lactation consultant said she needs a frenectomy. So then I went and got her a laser frenectomy. Yeah. And she did not she didn't need it. And so I was yeah. So it again, it's still everything's very virtual still. And so and she's a new baby, so they're like, we'll just do it over I think it was, like, Zoom or some type of, like, platform like this. And they had me, like, pull her I think pull her lip down so they could see under her tongue. And I'm looking at it, and there's nothing there to to be cut. Like, it's almost, like, smooth.
Speaker 1
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
And she's saying, like, oh, well, that needs to be, like, nicked pretty much. She needs a frenectomy. And I'm, like, I'm looking in her mouth. I'm, like, I don't see anything that can be cut. Like, they would literally be cutting the bottom of her tongue.
Speaker 3
Woah.
Speaker 4
And she's like, trust me. I know she can't touch the roof of her mouth, and she's saying that it's shaped like a c. It's just bringing me back, like, almost and she didn't need the frenectomy. I don't know what would have made that transition into breastfeeding better, but I think it was probably, like, two weeks where it was just, like, excruciating pain. And I eventually took her to a pediatrician because that, I feel like I did feel pressured to do. I reached out to a pediatrician, when I was still pregnant because, eventually, I did want her to have something because, again, it's, like, on the radar, not on the radar.
Speaker 2
Yeah.
Speaker 4
You know? And so I'm like, we'll have, periodic checkups. And so they were actually freaking out. It was six days, and I still hadn't brought her in. And they were like, we need her in. I felt I felt really pressured. But still the that's when they were like, oh, well, did she get vitamin k? And I'm like, no. And they're like, so do you wanna do it now? I'm like, no.
Speaker 2
At day six? That doesn't even make any sense.
Speaker 4
At that point, she's creating or I think it's, like, day eight. They start, like, their own vitamin k producing it on their own. I'm like, I can't take and that's where I was saying, like, I'm going back and forth between this, like, very medical and very wild space, and they were telling me she's she's lost too much weight. She was six pounds eleven ounces when she was born. I think she was six pounds four ounces when I brought her in. And then they told me you need to feed her every hour. You need to come in every day until she's back to birth weight. And me, I'm like, okay. Like, I don't want her to, like, be losing weight. You know? I get home, and I'm like, no. I canceled the appointment. We're not coming in every day. We're not doing this. She's a newborn. She will eat when she's hungry. Her stomach is the size of, like, I don't know, a walnut or something. You know what I mean? Like, it's ridiculous.
Speaker 2
Also, a stressed out a stressed out mom who's not resting, who's gonna be under resourced, like, going in and out, who's doing this on her own, who is freaking freshly postpartum, that doesn't help your milk supply. Like, that doesn't help your baby's nervous system. I mean, there's so much to consider. Okay. But so now you're through it and nursing's okay?
Speaker 4
Yes. So we nurse nursing is fine. Like, I feel like it's the I won't say easy, but if I think about, like, creating bottles and, like Mhmm. I don't know. I'm I never thought I would be so okay with just, like, whipping my nipple out in pieces. You know what I mean? Yeah. And I was actually at, I was out one day, and a mom was making a bottle. And I, like, just got in, like, a little corner, started nursing Sloan. And she's like, oh, I commend you. Blah blah blah. I'm like, there's nothing else for her to eat. I don't have any bottles. I don't have any formula. I don't have anything. She's gonna scream her head off, or I'm gonna pull my boob out and feed her. So yeah.
Speaker 2
Does the nursing still hurt?
Speaker 4
Actually, it stopped hurting completely. Good. And then just recently, like, in the last couple days even, I feel like it almost feels like there's just, like, a tug in, like, one spot in my nipple. Mhmm. And so I'm like, I don't know if it's a clog I don't know what it is. You know what I mean? But other than that, it's it's nowhere near what it was then. Like, it felt like nerve pain, like, in here. Look. I was just like, this can't be normal.
Speaker 2
Do you do breast massage? No. I don't. That might be something just while you're hanging out, you know, just when you're alone, just put a little, you know, oil on your breasts. Coconut oil doesn't have to be anything, like, you know, because the baby would probably wind up licking some of it. Yeah. But I wonder if just kinda, you know, just kinda like going around and and just getting some good flow would help Yeah. Help any funky. It's kinda the first move anyway if you do suspect a clogged duct or anything kind of funky. It's just make sure all your lymphatic system is flowing and open and hydrated and yeah. Wow.
Speaker 4
So you
Speaker 2
go back to work in August, and your mom's been around, it sounds like, to help?
Speaker 4
Yes. So she stayed with me for the first two weeks, and then I'm like, I really wanna get the hang of things on my own since I'm gonna be on my own majority of the time anyway. And so she went home, and that is when I mean, it was never, like, shit hit the fan, and it was just crazy. It was just, like, I think the biggest things are, I love to eat, and there's just no way to always
Speaker 2
My god.
Speaker 4
Right. Great food, which is what I always want
Speaker 0
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
With a newborn, nursing. You just don't always have the time. Yeah. Exactly. So and and then I'll say postpartum was much more difficult than I ever expected it to be. Yeah. I know people talk about it, and
Speaker 2
it's just like Everyone's blindsided by it. It doesn't matter how many times everyone's like, it's really hard, you guys. It's really hard.
Speaker 4
Oh my gosh. It was just like crying at the drop of a dime. Yeah. And it's like you're not sad.
Speaker 2
You're just hormonal. It's just so intense. So how do you eat? How do you like, what's your system as a solo mama?
Speaker 4
So now I have a, like, a wrap. So I'll put her in my wrap, and I'll cook and eat. Sometimes I try to make more. I never really like leftovers. So now I just make more, and I'll heat stuff up, stuff like that. But Yeah. I think now it's gotten to the point where she'll play on the floor, like, on her mat or something or in, like, a little seat or something, and I can do other things. But Mhmm. Initially, it was just very difficult.
Speaker 2
Totally.
Speaker 4
I saw someone ask somewhere which part of pregnancy was the worst, like, the very beginning when you have, like, your food aversions and morning sickness and stuff, the last trimester or postpartum. And someone's like, I would do the last trimester for ten months over postpartum. And I'm like, yeah. It could be it's, like, really difficult. Yeah. It's the most difficult.
Speaker 2
Yeah. I mean, it's just it's not meant to be done so alone. Yeah. You know, and I don't I don't mean
Speaker 4
So my mom
Speaker 2
will be there. Yeah. I mean, like, all of us. Like, it's Yeah. It's meant
Speaker 4
Oh, like, with a village and, like, people Like, it's meant to be done
Speaker 2
physically, you know, that we're in a restorative state and just, you know, who gets that? It's just a very it's a very hard, bar, you know, to to to actualize in our in today's, you know, culture.
Speaker 4
Yeah. And who really tends to the postpartum mother? You know what I mean? Like, they want you there. Even on the medical side, like, they want you there every four weeks even though, I don't know, there's no relationship there. I cannot with
Speaker 2
the, like, well, baby bullshit industry.
Speaker 4
I didn't go back for my, like, six week, checkup, and I've had people say, oh my gosh. You need to go you need to go do that. I'm like, why?
Speaker 2
Why? What's what's under that? What is the thing? What is
Speaker 4
the thing?
Speaker 2
I know. It's just people don't like to think for themselves. And so when women do think for themselves, it's this, like, alien concept, You know? Like, someone else, like, a a a doctor hasn't told you it's okay to fill in the blank. I mean, it's so infantilizing.
Speaker 4
I even cringe, like, I know some women who, like, they went back and they had a pap smear at their six week. And I'm like, I don't want anything in there.
Speaker 2
Oh, yeah. Yep. No. Totally. I'm with you. Well, what a wild story. Thank you for sharing it.
Speaker 4
Of course.
Speaker 2
I'm proud of you. That's such a big journey and, yeah, cool, calm, and collected. Mama Zan.
Speaker 4
That's so funny.
Speaker 2
That's amazing. Awesome. Well, thank you so much.
Speaker 4
For having me.
Speaker 2
And that's it for today, my sisters. Check out everything we do, including one on one and group coaching. Learn about our private membership, in person retreats, and more on free birth society dot com. Our online courses flagship course, the complete guide to free birth. Don't miss the radical birth keeper school, if you're ready to become the authentic midwife that women are searching for. Together we rise and the revolution starts inside each of us. I'll leave you with our Freebird Society theme song, Wild Woman by Aruba Red.
Speaker 3
I honor you for the wisdom you held, the ancient traditions of plant medicine and womb magic. I feel the spirit of the ancestors as I place my hands upon my belly. This sacred portal will be honored, eons upon light beams of survival, withstanding the eradication of our power by design. I will not allow the separation of our young to be forced upon me. My sisters will no longer birth in captivity. The picket line redefined from burning our wild women to paralyzing us and drugging out babes. Babes. Strapped down in a clinical white bed, drying up the milk from our breasts, keep your needles. My family will never again be doomed to chase those dragons all your poison. We rejected your fear. We choose love. Everything with intention. Death, ascension. I will fly and bring her back to the star.
