Speaker 0
Into the wild, I'm going into the wild, I am. It's been a wild freedom child, since I left my roots back home. Into the wild I'm good. Into the wild I am. It's been a while, freedom child, since I left my roots back home.
Speaker 1
Welcome to the Free Birth Society podcast. This is a radical space for women who are ready to celebrate their autonomous choices in birth, motherhood, and beyond. Together, we'll learn about wild birth through personal narrative. We'll explore the politics of birth, and we'll analyze everything that relates to our lives as women from a feminist perspective. Here's your host, Emilee Saldaya.
Speaker 0
It's been a wild freedom change since I've left my rules back home.
Speaker 2
If you're like most of my listeners, you are devouring these episodes, fascinated by the women's stories and wondering if you could do this too. Do you wish that you had a step by step strategy for how to actually plan and manifest your free birth? Our complete guide to free birth is the number one course for free birth, and we made it for women just like you. It's a self guided online intensive course that will teach you everything we think you need to know about how to birth freely and in your power. We'll take you all the way from unpacking industrial care to what DIY prenatal care looks like, how to pick and prep your support team, what to expect, look out for, and how to shift when more support could be needed. Yes. We'll cover the what ifs, how to prevent complications, and how to orient your entire life towards a powerful birth. So head on over to free birth society courses dot com now and take the first step towards the birth of your dreams. I'm excited to share with you all today Janessa's beautiful free birth story, which is truly a reclamation of so many parts of her first birth, a hospital birth. After she consistently gave her power away in her first pregnancy and in her birth, by the time she got pregnant again, she knew she was going to do things very differently. With her second, Janessa chose a peaceful pregnancy over a pregnancy in the system and a free birth over a hospitalized experience. Through taking responsibility for her choices, Janessa was able to reclaim everything that she had given away in her first birth, even down to smiling through her peaceful emergence.
Speaker 3
Beautiful. My name is Janessa Liu. I'm here on Big Island with my husband, Ray, and our two daughters, Sol and Clear. And, yeah, we landed on island after choosing. We were staying in the states, and we were looking for where we wanted to relocate to from San Francisco. And we even looked into potentially North Carolina with you and, multiple states, and then synchronistic events led us here. And we were, we were looking to build intentional community, whether that's living on land with others or joining a community. And so what we're doing here is building a retreat center in our home. And we're in a year and we live as a family in this year with two, two king-size family beds together. And then we have a tree house and we have other structures to, to have retreats and, and stay with us. Yeah. And I, after the RBK school, I launched my own business, heart womb mother dot com. And I support women in getting intimate with their inner world, with their lives, with their experience, and also as a radical birth keeper. And I'm actually serving women now on island. Yeah. Birthing outside of the system. And when you read my page about what it can be like from, from conscious conception through to wild pregnancy and, birth, the way that you dream and nourishing postpartum, it's really about using that experience to come into the body and to have this transcendental spiritual experience. And, yeah, I'm getting to do that with women now and walk with them.
Speaker 4
Good. Yay. So proud of you. I can't wait to hear more about your birth stories that kinda bring you up to this point. Right? So, yeah, love that. I'm so proud of you. I I love the the reality of how many women have used the school to pivot into authentic birth work. And, you know, so many women, the majority of the students are like, yeah. But, like, I probably won't find anyone, and it'll probably be you know, no one wants it in my area. And you're living proof that it's absolutely true. So take us to the beginning with your first kiddo or your first pregnancy, and who were you then, and what did that pregnancy and birth look like?
Speaker 3
Oh my gosh. The who were you then? What's so interesting is I still don't have my cycle back from this pregnancy, and she's, fourteen fifteen months. And with Soljay, the first born, I also didn't get my cycle back until thirty months after conception. So just under two years for her and the way I related to. To blood and to my cycle back then, like, I didn't even call it a cycle. I, you know, just call it a period. And I related to it as you know, that thing that happens every month. And we we did have a conscious conception. So I was my awareness was there in in that first pregnancy in that way. And it was the the whole aspect of conscious conception was Ray had already wanted kids and I wasn't ready yet. And then there became a time where I was ready. And so then we were intentionally allowing ourselves to, to try. And it was a and that just kinda shifted. It just happened. Like, all of a sudden I realized, okay, I'm ready. And it was our our eighteen year old's dog's birthday weekend. Party night. Yeah. And, yeah. And then we it that was the the whole piece around the conception, and we we just intentionally decided, okay. We're gonna open the portal now. And we we conceived in the first time. And I, again, at the time, like, I even after he came inside me, I I had him, like, lift up my legs and, like, hold me up and and just, like, try to make it work. You know? This must be why it worked. And yeah. And we we got pregnant. And at the time, home birth was not in my awareness at all. I don't have anyone in my life who who's even had a home birth. Even now, definitely being on island and just in the spheres I'm in, you know, it's everywhere, including free birth. But then there there was no one in my life that it wasn't even an option. I hadn't even considered it. I do have a recollection that I associated home birth with, like, why would you want that mess in your home?
Speaker 4
Or, like, when people say, it's gonna be a murder scene.
Speaker 3
Exactly. Yeah. I I don't know where I picked that up, but it was like, there's gonna be blood everywhere. Like, why would you wanna do that in your
Speaker 4
On the walls. Yeah. It's funny.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And so it was always gonna be a hospital birth, and we were in California. And my pregnancy, I was still working in, in tech, and my my role involved traveling all over the world. So when I became pregnant at first, my first trimester was like, just vomiting and a lot of nausea and, yeah, and I was really fully in the system. And so I was taking, like, the sleeping pill that they get you to do with, like, vitamin vitamin a combo. I don't know. Unisem. Yeah. Taking that regularly every day and and, just puking after getting off the subway.
Speaker 4
I'm just loving the one eighty of your life right now. This is hilarious. Like, now you're in this, like, golden angelic light within a yurt on big island. It's so amazing.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Dramatic. And it was all, like, through the the journeys of the births too. And, like, having the second pregnancy guide, like, okay. We wanna find this new home to land. So yeah. And it was really rough. And I remember thinking like, oh gosh, I thought I wanted more kids, but if this is how it is, like, not gonna do it again. And and then just being in the system, I developed like all these major fears, fears around how my weight gain was happening. I remember being in one of my prenatal sessions and my dot in first trimester was, like, way off the curve at the beginning and gained a lot really quickly. And then having this the OB, the woman just straight up, like, look at me with a glare and ask, are you sure you're not eating too many desserts?
Speaker 4
Ew.
Speaker 3
Yeah. I burst into tears. And inside, I was like, Chai, I'm using too many desserts. And I'm I don't know what I'm doing. And it was it was that moment even more so that I just really gave away all of my power and and really just, like, fell into her lap of, like, you're right. I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm a mess. I this is my first time, and she actually ended up scheduling me a, therapist appointment for being a mom who's or a pregnant mom. And I was like, yeah. This doesn't feel right, but you must know best. And so I went for the appointment, and it was with a guy.
Speaker 4
Ew. And Weird.
Speaker 3
For a pregnant mom. Right? So And he was so monotone and so creepy vibes, And I was like, what am I doing? Like, he was asking me questions about if I feel safe. And I'm like, in my body, I'm like, no. Not in this moment. Like, what am I doing? And that actually was, like, starting to be, not total conscious awareness that there was, like, this isn't resonating because I was still giving up my power. But I was like, this doesn't make sense. And I never went back to the therapist, but I still did stay in the system.
Speaker 4
It's really you know, within the lack of with our lack of elder wisdom and, you know, authentic midwives in our community and, you know, because no one we know has home birthed and everything you just said, we're so primed to fall for the predatory system. I mean, especially when the predatory system is literally the default mainstream system. It's just such a perfect combination, you know, to set us up to do exactly what you're describing.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it caused so much stress. And then I brought that stress home to Ray of, like, okay. We need to go to every single prenatal class that they offer and just, like, get it right. And we, like, learned about how you're supposed to eat. And I started, like, this little journal with, like, the dots of, like, getting all the different things you need in a day. And it was just so overwhelming and added so much stress. And I actually ended up just, like, throwing it out. And I'm like, no. Like, this is not helping. And once I made that shift, the the pregnancy got to be more of my own and actually can see the themes that really, you know, were true to me come through. So in the middle of of working in in SF and traveling, We have our we had our annual conference, which is I think it was in October or something that year, and I my due date because I was, you know, in the system with the due date. The time is in December. My birthday is the eighth of December, and her her due date was the fifth. And so I was really excited about that. We had our big conference in October. And so, like, leading up to that, I was I was traveling and presenting and and just feeling great, and also feeling proud that I was gonna head into this natural hospital birth, which I I did know that I didn't wanna do an epidural. I was, like, so into those apps, like the what to do when you're expecting, like, community forums. And I was, like, reading, like, every not like the free birth society birth stories. I was reading like every hospital birth story I could read.
Speaker 5
Woah.
Speaker 3
And and like taking that in and learning about how to navigate within and knowing that I wanted to to still stay away from an epidural, but having in the back of my mind, like, but if I have to, you know, of course I will. And yeah. And I learned about Pitocin. I learned that it was often, like, turned way too far up. And so I did have some inkling of, like, okay. If I have to do Pitocin, like, hopefully, I get a nurse who's gonna be cool with that and, like, not dialing it too far. Oh. Yeah. And as as the birth approach, what was beautiful is I also got to include some, Vipassana mindfulness retreats. So Ray and I, during Solje's pregnancy, we were finishing a two year mindfulness teacher training. And so I actually got to sit on silent retreat pregnant. And it was just this deepening of really getting to go inside, not be responsible for your meals or anything, or even Ray. Like he was on the retreat too, but we intentionally decided we wouldn't even like try to make eye contact. And I just got to be with Solje and start learning how to go in and hear her intuitive kicks and communing with her. And and it was beautiful other than for one of those retreats, I was in a shared room. So I was that pregnant lady in, like, third trimester, like, peeing, like, getting up and peeing, like, you know, every what felt like, you know, multiple like, at least three or four times in the night. And yeah. So that, like, looking back, I see as these pieces of, you know, the journey and having people be like, wow, you're not gonna do an epidural. Like, oh my gosh. It's the first thing I want. And just being like, yeah, I'm gonna try. And and even being shy about that. Like, you know, the the the the goal that's, like, way out there that, like, might be possible. Yeah.
Speaker 4
Isn't it so weird how many people, like like this, like, mindfulness, you know, like the yoga the yogi, the hippie that goes into the hospital? It's, like, such a strange cognitive dissonance that so many people carry. We're out of alignment with the things that, like, that fundamentally stands for. You know?
Speaker 3
Exactly. So I took one of these prenatal classes and, like, schedule them all in advance. You know, they're like, get them in earlier. You'll you, you know, won't they'll be too full. And, one was was pain labor manage yeah. Even the name, like, managing the pain of labor naturally. There's just, like, so much in that, you know, like, even just managing. And, so that class was actually also one of those those pieces of awareness that wasn't quite at the surface. But what you're saying, like, that dissonance where I was hearing from them, like, doing the ice cube exercise where you, like, hold the ice cube. And then just like and and then the the suggestions they had of, like, take your mind elsewhere and really just being like, this that's not how I would how I would, you know, coach anyone to to meet something is like, go daydream and leave yourself.
Speaker 4
Go go disassociate.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Go right.
Speaker 4
It's not go daydream. It's dissociate, which if you can't do that in the middle of labor, here's your epidural.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. And so I did get to go through that class and be like, oh, everything they're saying is, like, everything I'm practicing. Mhmm. Well and also the opposite of what I'm practicing. But it was just more confidence of, oh, okay. I know that I've been practicing on how to meet my body, how to meet sensations, how to meet thoughts and discern them. And so I was like, this is gonna be an amazing natural hospital birth. And so when we I got to have my four weeks before the the due date and was off work. And one of those weeks was on that retreat, like, thirty seven weeks and which was wild, but really beautiful. And then we get to her due date week and the I was because I was so in those apps, you know, there's all that buzz of, like, how do you get labor started? Like, what are all the ways that I can get things going, get things moving? And so I had learned that if you have sex and the semen can potentially get things going. And so I was really excited to have a birthday twin, even though her guest date was her due date was the fifth. I was like, it would be great to have it on on the eighth. And so the morning of the fourth, Ray was like, let's have sex. And I was like, no, like, what if it gets things started? And, you know, my birthday twin, like so weird and selfish. And now I'm actually happy that she was born in the fifth, but yeah, the morning of the fourth. And so we did, and then I was still laying in bed and like twenty minutes later, I felt this, this gush. And so I got up and I went to the bathroom and of course my water broke And I was, like, running around or was in the bathroom, like, you popped me. You popped me. And, we're you know, we did the first thing you do when you when you're in the hospital system. We we right away, like, called and said, you know, I think my water broke. I can feel sensation. It feels like I'm peeing myself. And they're like, okay. Come on in. And my mom was staying with us, and we we we all already had, you know, the hospital bag packed, and we were all ready. But I had the vision of being at home, getting to be with my labor and be with the sensations and and labor at home before going in. So I thought we were just gonna go in and come home and then get to labor because I didn't have any sensations yet. It was just my water starting to break. So we went in. It was the morning, and we get there. And then in triage, they, you know, they have me pee, and and they say, yep. Your water definitely broke, and you're not going home today. You're you're staying here. And there was definitely that, like, oh, like, woof. There goes all of that visualized, like, dream that I had, but, you know, gotta be here. And so I started explaining to her, what my birth plan was, and and I remember I can even, like, see the the look. I remember saying, like, I want it to be as natural as possible and just, like, her looking over her sheet, like, okay. But, like, we'll see. And then, I said, but you like, even I responded because it was so, like, we'll see that. I was like, but, of course, like, whatever's, you know, safe, we're gonna do.
Speaker 4
Hey. You better be the good girl.
Speaker 3
Exactly.
Speaker 4
And her thought her look was not we'll see. It was, yeah, fucking right.
Speaker 3
Exactly. You know? It was.
Speaker 4
Yeah. Of course. I mean, especially with with open waters and no waves first time mom, there's there's no way you're getting out of there without an induction. It just doesn't there's there's just way too much money to make off of you.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And that that's what her face said. And and then, of course, the state I'm in, we'll do whatever we need we have to do. And so we she says, yeah. We're gonna send you up to the room and so I'm like, oh, alright. Okay. Making good with this, like, new path. And then we get to the room. Now one thing that I did, like, again, me thinking and true to me was like, okay. If I'm gonna be in the hospital, I'm gonna make this the the best environment that I can. You know, learned you can't bring incense, learned you can't bring real candles. So bought, like, a bunch of the electronic ones, and, we we we set the room up, and Ray brought his flute. And we we just knew and a and a beautiful birth playlist. And so, again, I thought, like, at the time, my awareness was like, this is how you do, you know, natural birth and no sensations yet. So those halls, like that small little square root became like the place. I was like, okay. I'm determined. Because what they told me was, yeah, to your point, you have eight hours. We'll give you eight hours. And if you if your sent if your contractions aren't strong enough by that point, then you'll start Pitocin. I I was like, okay. I really, you know, don't wanna take Pitocin, but, you know, if I have to. And so I was determined, which is also like the energy of, like, trying to force it to happen. So it's like we blew up the yoga ball and, like, Ray and I are, like, walking this course over and over and bouncing on the ball and trying to do all these things. And, actually, sensations did start. And so we labored. And as the hours passed, then the contractions started getting even stronger. And they got to a point where I was in the halls needing to stop and just breathe through them because they were they were that intense. And I remember it was getting near the end of my my window that I was allowed. And so I went by the the desk of all the nurses, and they're kinda laughing because they knew, like, here she's trying to get this done. They probably knew I was bound to get Pitocin. And so I said like, Hey, actually, my, my contractions now, like I just had a couple where I had to stop and pause and breathe through them. They were that strong. And they just looked at me and they're like, you're still smiling. And no. No. No. You need to be doubled over in pain and not smiling for us to not do Pitocin. Yeah.
Speaker 4
That's a sobering comment. God.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So I just took that in. I was like, oh. And, again, it was like one of those moments where I'm like, oh, okay. You know, this makes sense. Like, I I'm supposed to be doubled over. Like, I'm so far from that. I'm still smiling. And so yeah. Then I went back to the room, and they they got me started on it. And, thankfully, I had I'd heard this beautiful wisdom from a sister that a a contraction has a peak and a valley and then there's space between and that you can use that space between to to reset, to come back to center, to, you know, that that sensation, that contraction that passed will never be the same again. You'll always have a new one. And so you can just let it go and start fresh. And that once you reach the top of the pain, which also doesn't necessarily need to be pain, which we can get to, but when you get to the top of the pain that you're on the other side and there will be a decline and that you can enjoy that and actually allow yourself to, to feel pleasure in that. Like, okay, I'm on the decline. And so when I started the Pitocin, that was my experience of the sensations, and it did get things going pretty quickly. And the way that I was was being with it was I was trying different positions. I had thought, like, all fours was gonna feel great. And I was like, oh my gosh. Like, next contraction, get me out of this. I tried different ones. And what I really loved was sitting down with my back against the the wall and my legs crossed and just sitting on the floor. And there was a point where I was I was able to be with them. And then there was a point they kept dialing up the Pitocin when no there was no longer any stop, of course. And so it was just like it was just incessant
Speaker 4
And pain.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Like, torture, pain, and no longer able to find any sense of of grounding. And Ray noticed as well, and he didn't say anything, but he's like, yeah. Her Pitocin must be too high. She's not even able to come back in between. There was no in between. I was so grateful that there was a nurse who came in and she noticed my struggle. And she she actually said, this seems a little bit too high. I'm gonna turn that down for you. So I was, I'm grateful for that. Because when she turned it down, I did get to come back to having some space in between. And
Speaker 4
so dangerous.
Speaker 3
Yeah. That that that I'm, like, lucky to have had that when all of the stories I'd heard, that's, like, not what women experienced. And and I was at the point too where I hadn't had my I hadn't been checked for dilation. I didn't want to be. It didn't that was one thing that didn't make sense to me. Like, why would you check if that increases risk and it doesn't mean anything in a sense of it can change so quickly? I was starting to get to the point when it was high, like, oh my gosh. Like, I don't know if I can do this. And, of course. You know? And so, I but then there was a shift. So this was, like, the bridge this has been a bridge to my next pregnancy as well of I there was one contraction where I realized, like, inwardly on how to really meet the pain and to allow it to to not push it away in any way, but to actually channel it down into the ground and let mama Earth receive that sensation. So not try to resist it in any way and just basically like blast it downward. And after that contraction, Ray was like, what happened? Like something shifted there. Is there just such an ease and a peace? And I was like, I figured it out. I'll tell you, like, next contraction. And yeah. And then from then on, I was just able to, to really meet them and, and just allow it to be full body, but to not resist it. Although, again, it was my Pitocin was still going. So I knew or I didn't know this, but I I was really starting to feel like, okay, if this gets any more also moving into transition, like, if this gets any more intense, like, I might actually do the epidural. And so they came in and checked me. They said and I was like, if I'm not far enough along, which is also one of those mind games. Like, if I had have heard that I was, like, anywhere I was nine. If I had have heard, like, maybe any lower, at that point, I might have even taken the epidural.
Speaker 4
Worse.
Speaker 3
Yeah. But thankfully, hearing nine, I was like, okay. I've gotten this far. Like, I can do this. And then my contractions started to be in those like, now as this is all going on, I'm all the nurses are like taking turns to come in to see me because it was such a big event to have a woman not do an epidural. And they were not used to hearing any of these sounds, and they just had such a kick out of it. And they're like, wow. This, like, brings us back. And
Speaker 4
I've heard, I've had nurses admit to me that when women come in saying they don't want the epidural, they ramp the pit up extra high so that it breaks them so that they can be easier clients or easier patients. Insane.
Speaker 3
Yeah. One little contrast. Like, when I learned in the complete guide to free birth about pitocin impacting like, prohibiting, blocking your natural oxytocin, that was, like, one of the mo there were so many moments, but that was one of the moments I paused it and, like, raged
Speaker 4
I bet.
Speaker 3
Because of that, you know? And it's like I was walking the halls having sensations that were stopping me.
Speaker 4
And you were completely robbed. I mean, you were doomed from the start being in the system, but you were completely robbed of of what your body was absolutely doing. Yeah. It's it's absolutely tragic.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And so they were all coming in and out, and then one came in and noticed that I was now starting to, like, make this more, like, grunting, like, and could feel, like, the the body, like, wanting to push or wanting she was, you know, moving down the canal. And so she said, okay. Now it's time, things are happening. I don't you're you're things have changed. And so the midwife started to become more involved. And from then on, it was like another, okay, Janessa, like, you've been guiding yourself. You learned how to be with with these sensations, but it's like I gave over everything again, because I didn't know how to push a baby out. All I've been told is, like, you gotta push a baby out and that there's a specific way to push. And so she's like, I'm gonna tell you no. I asked, like, how do you do it? And what her and the nurses told me is it's like you're taking the biggest poop of your life. And to to focus on the muscles like you were pooping. Like, you were really constipated, but you're gonna push this this poop out.
Speaker 4
It makes me think they they well, obviously, they have no idea what they're talking about, but, like like, they have literally no idea what they're talking about. Like, I just gave birth six weeks ago. I'm I'm very close to the, the sensations of what it what it took of me, And what a weird bizarre way to frame it. Yeah.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And, like, okay. Now I'm locked in. Like, I'm gonna be that good like, do my absolute best at, like,
Speaker 4
blowing my mouth.
Speaker 3
Well yeah. And I I got hemorrhoids, and I never had hemorrhoids.
Speaker 4
Did. Yeah. Of course. It's a hemorrhoid recipe. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, god. Okay. So your little sweet first time mama self is like, tell me what to do, and they're like, tell me what to do. Garbage. Yeah.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And and I took all of it. And so and actually beyond that, I was, like, intuitively not pushing for a few of the first ones. Like, just letting my body continue to ride them. And the midwife was pretty angry at me, and she's like, now you're just wasting contractions. If you don't push, what are we doing here? Use every contraction to push.
Speaker 4
Oh my god.
Speaker 3
So for the next three and a half hours, I used every contraction to push. And it's, like, three and a half hours of that. And, yeah, a lot of me wonders, like, you know, what would that have been like if I had have just listened to myself? And so pushed, like, the photos. I also did have oxygen mask. I don't remember consenting to that. They put it in catheter. I did not even know that that happened. I found out later. Yeah. Because I hadn't peed, and I did tell them, like, I'm I'm having I I haven't peed. And so instead of, like, working with me to try to get me to pee, yeah, that happened without, asking. And there yeah. I didn't know I had the oxygen till I looked back in photos. And, like, all the photos of the the three and a half hours, I'm just, like, in such pain. I'm, like, pushing with my absolute might because that's what they told, breaking blood vessels in my eyes. My face is all puffy by the end. Just, like, such a contrast. And, yeah, and then, the whole time, the midwife was, like, using her hands to to hold the openings in certain ways. And I remember feeling so grateful after being like, thank goodness I had you there to make sure the baby came out right. And when she when she finally emerged, she, like, told me to stop and then took the baby. And and then it's you know, you you, of course, know this. Like, as soon as the baby's out, like, all the energy in the room is just like and so we had said in advance we wanted Ray to be you know, if he can even catch the baby or if he can be the one to give the baby to me, that all didn't happen. We actually hear in the video, it's like, excuse me, daddy. And it's just like all the rush. And Yeah. He does get to cut the cord, which we thought, you know, delayed clamping. It was, like, literally two minutes after. When they when they put might have been less. When they put her on my chest, I was I was aware and with it enough that I got to have a really special moment. And I said, hello, bear, which is actually what we called our that eighteen year old dog. So she immediately got her his nickname. And he passed away a month two months before she came. And so, like, I had that awareness, but I was still so disoriented from just being in it for the time. And without saying anything, literally minutes after, within five minutes, it was probably four minutes. There was a hand going up. First they started the fundal massage, and that was so painful. And I was like, what's happening? And then they went up my yoni and started scraping the placenta off the wall. So I had no chance to actually birth it naturally. And that was excruciating. That was like I was just in so much pain. There was no natural piece of that at all. Didn't get to see the placenta, and they whisked it away. And, yeah, that was our first the first birth. So we did the we did the hospital thing. We stayed there, and we felt so accomplished. Like, okay. Now we understand what labor means. A woman just needs to take and work, and thank goodness we have, you know, midwives to make sure that they come out and safely. And so proud that I had a not natural burn.
Speaker 4
Which makes no sense.
Speaker 3
I also didn't recognize the placenta thing until watching complete guide. That was another, like, oh my gosh.
Speaker 4
Yeah. Sick. Right. That's the sickest part is to emerge feeling so victorious. You know? It makes me think about, like I'm not specifically talking about you. I'm obviously making observation about the whole the whole result of of our society, but, like, you know, women who think they're into BDSM, you know, so that they have the air quotes power to be abused. It's so twisted and sick, but it's the reframe that victims often will make to survive within a system where they're being completely gaslit.
Speaker 3
Mhmm.
Speaker 4
It's such it's so painful. Right. Of course. Yeah. Of course, you're stoked. You made it out without an epidural. Right? And the bar is so low. It's like you did the thing, and you have this beautiful baby. It's so painful. It really unfolds in layers, doesn't it?
Speaker 3
Yeah. And, like, the immediate postpartum picture, my eyes are bloodshot and busted, like, literally blood blood vessels, hemorrhoids, and a catheter wound that actually impacted me for more than a year, and none of that was consented. Yeah. That's fine.
Speaker 4
None of it's really consented to. You know? Like, there's no real consent in the system. You didn't really consent to Pitocin. You were coerced, manipulated, and threatened to have it.
Speaker 3
Right. There's no By Right. By consent, I mean, not even at not even saying the words. Yeah. You don't even even telling even aware of it. Yeah.
Speaker 4
Jesus. Yeah. Totally. Yeah. I mean, I've been to births where when I was a doula back in the day where I'd I'd, like, walk in to join them, like, they already were in the hospital, And the mom would think that she's just on an IV bag, and she's on Pitocin. And they haven't even told her. They just started the drip. And I'll walk over and be like, oh, they've already started you on pit. And she's like, no. No. It's just IV fluids. Like, what the fuck? Yeah.
Speaker 3
Exactly. So
Speaker 4
then what happens? How do you, you know, how can you kind of articulate your journey from there to who you are into choosing free birth?
Speaker 3
Yeah. So we we we got to to go home, and we did have some we had some breastfeeding trouble for the first weeks. And, really, you know, I know there's there's different thoughts on tongue tie. For us, we were told originally in the hospital that she had potentially a mild tie, but it was nothing to worry about. And for us, it was the exact reason why we struggled, and we it was it was really it was those were tough weeks. Like, we were we were we went we were trusting the system as well for breastfeeding. And so we were going in every week to have her have her weighed to the mama at the mama's support group, and she was losing weight every week. And my I had the milk, and she was just not able to get it out because of the tongue tie. And so then, thankfully, we we started down our own research. I don't know how we originally found it, but we've started to find these blogs on, like, breastfeeding struggles and and to to learn that sometimes tongue ties are are mislabeled or said that they aren't one. And so for us, that was kind of the first journey out of the system. And also at the same time, we were deciding, like, were we gonna vaccinate? And for our awareness at the time of the birth was that's just what you do. So she actually received the vaccines in the hospital. My mom, who was total freedom fighter, like activist, it it broke her heart. And she actually asked at one point, like, are you just don't get the ones here. Like, you know, we can talk about it more. And I'm like, she already got them, mom. Because, like, that was, like, the very first thing, you know, they just put it in. And so that was also the first time that I really started questioning these things because my mom said, there's this whole series of videos you can watch. Like, please just just watch them before you decide to get her next round. And, you know, you can make your own decision. And so Ray and I watched them. And, yeah, back at that time, like, that was all completely new for us, not something we would ever question. And we were just eating up the videos, and it really asked us to question how we relate to the to the system in in general. And we we went to her first appointment, and we recognized that the whole point of the appointment was, like, just to to jab your child. Like, there's they weren't actually doing anything. And so we're like, wow. This is, like, adding up with what we're considering. And so we we didn't. We said, yeah. We're still gonna hold off. We're we're thinking about, like, delayed schedule. That was just kind of a story. And then they brought in they're like, you know, that those same kind of glares, like, and they brought in their, like, head of immunology or whatever. Actually, I started asking her questions, and she didn't know they answered any of the questions because I had started doing my research. And, like, you know, there's, like, this these journeys that we need to take on our own to really relate to these questions so we can feel confident to leave these systems that don't make sense when you really look at actual evidence. And, Yeah. And so we we did in and then we I think we went to a couple other of those well checks and realized again, like, all they're trying I know my child's thriving. This is when our intuitive trust in parenting, like sticking with breastfeeding. And then when we actually had the tongue tie, reversed at six weeks, everything changed. She immediately fed. There was, it was just night and day, everything. And then we got to get off of the pump. We got to get off the supplemental nursing system, the round the clock, the the cap the, like, literally doing it to the hour, which all of the system told us to do. And then I got to just be this woman walking around. Like, I remember the first hike we took and just, like, having the boob. Like, I don't need anything else. And it was so easy. And so as this this journey is unfolding of of, wow, we stuck with our gut on wanting to breastfeed, even though our parents were like, you know, she's losing weight, and everyone's saying just do the formula thing and da da da da. Like, even the the breastfeeding support team were, like, you know, trying to get us some formula, and we just didn't want to. We were stubborn. And and that built the resilience. And so we also completely stepped outside of taking her to any more, pediatric appointments. It just didn't make sense. Like, they were just asking checking on her ability to thrive when I know my child, and she's she's well beyond your measured milestone.
Speaker 4
I know. It's so weird, but we're supposed to go as women, we're supposed to go to well women's visits. Like, it never ends. I remember when I was pregnant for the first time, I think it was my mom was like, are you gonna take the baby to a pediatrician? And I was like, no. And she was like, well, you know, whatever. She asked me something about it. And I remember saying back then, if anything ever goes on with my baby that I am not sure about, like, if any if something presents that's beyond what I'm familiar with and what makes sense to me and what I can intuit, there are so many people in my life that I would go to first before I went to a doctor who has never met my baby, who doesn't love me, who doesn't care what I have to say, and who's seen, you know, a thousand kids in a week. And that was kind of always how I approached it in the beginning. I'm way more hardcore about this stuff now, but my first pregnancy was, you know, over five years ago. And I was like, I just can't imagine something will happen that I don't first understand, you know, or that I, yeah, that I don't know what it is, and it's still true. You know, she's five and nothing's happened. And I know that's not true for every parent. Sometimes there's, like, crazy weird stuff that happens, you know, and we that hasn't occurred in our household. But the whole well the whole well baby thing is such a scam.
Speaker 3
Yeah. And we just started seeing that clearly. And and then it got to be, oh, wow. Okay. Like, we made the conscious choice to just just opt out. And and that really opened up the door of, like, all of the systems that we get to opt out of. And so that's when home birth started entering my awareness of, like, oh, well, you know, they just put that first vaccine in her, you know, the vitamin k and the the hep b, like, minutes. Like, it was, you know, so fast. And so why would I want to be there and to risk, having that happen? And I was hearing stories about how even if you decline them, it can still happen.
Speaker 4
And Oh, yeah.
Speaker 3
And so it was home birth, but I hadn't heard of free birth. And it we we knew that we wanted to conceive again, and I hadn't got my cycle back, as I said, for for thirty months. It was it was September. So Solje was born in December, and it was after her first year. So almost two years, September. And I we had just stopped, night feeding. And I had started I learned about fertility awareness method. And so we were charting and we I had I actually got to chart and witness my first ovulation. So that month in September, I got to see the thermal shifts, and it was anovulatory before. And so when that happened, I actually just the other day went back into my Instagram messages and I looked to see when it was that I learned about free birth because someone was sharing it on their stories. And I had never heard of it before. And I actually reached out and said, thank you for sharing these. This is a completely new concept to me. I, we've been intuiting home birth. We weren't yet pregnant, but that happened in the same month. The first ovulation is when I learned about pre birth. Society specifically. And then in October, I had, we we we didn't conceive, and I had a bleed. And that was it was so sacred because I hadn't had a bleed since before Solje. And back then, I was referring to it as, like, my period, just the thing that happens. And the journey of those two years of my life and, like, opting out of these systems and learning about fertility awareness method, learning. Like, when I first learned about that, that was, like, again, one of those just so much grief of, like, how am I thirty two, thirty one, and, like, first learning about this?
Speaker 4
Oh, yeah. Totally.
Speaker 3
And giving me the confidence to to to listen to my body and and to see how it those other ways that we do things are not even related to the individual. Like, that that's not my specific ovulation schedule. And so I got to have the bleed. I offered the blood to the earth, and it was only one bleed. And then the next month, we conceived. So I still only had one bleed. Yeah. And so when we when we conceived, we had been now this is twenty twenty. So we actually quit our corporate jobs in the beginning of that year, and we had the intention of becoming nomadic and traveling the world and like visiting other intentional communities and learning to see what we what we wanted. But of course, everything, you know, the pandemic. And so we were grounded. We moved to Canada to be with my family for that year. And it was divine because it was actually the last year of my mom's life.
Speaker 0
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
And she her yeah. Her health declined, that entire year. And so around September was when it was really fast paced. She had cancer, and she was also not wanting to be in take chemo and be in a system. And it was, like, learning together, like, seeing her health and how she was opting out even in, like, such dire conditions. And me reclaiming my own sovereignty in that. And then when we conceived, we were doing FAM. And so I didn't want to take a pregnancy test. I wanted to see the temperature, you know, for the, the eighteen days. And it landed on the day before Solje's birthday, so December fifth. And so we got to take a test. We did wanna take the test and we took a pregnancy test and got to share that with her. And she was still in her awareness to receive that, and she ended up passing away in January. Wow. So it's pretty magic. Like, if we had have conceived any later, I wouldn't have been able to to share that with her. So I really love that. And then in January, she passed and then it was like, okay. We we don't need to figure out, like, go see all these other places. Let's just find where we're gonna live. I'm pregnant now. We wanna root. And that brings us to, like, finding Hawaii. And we didn't know where we'd be or if we would even have a home structure. So if you remember talking with you, like, you had raw land. Like, I was ready to give birth in a, like, a van or, like, some sort of pen structure. And actually, let me rewind. So September when I learned about free birth, I was like eating it up and like, what? I didn't know this was even possible. I didn't know this existed. This is blowing my mind. And I saw that you had the complete guide to free birth. And so we bought that. And I even sent a message to you, and you mentioned the membership. And I joined the membership and got to just surround myself by these women who were doing it. And so that whole pregnancy got to be journeying with The Complete Guide. And as I mentioned before, it's like every single video was, like, paused and, like, Ray and I being, like, what? Totally. No. Like, raging around the house and, like, just, yeah. It was I recommend that to to any woman just to learn, you know, just to learn about the sovereignty that we can have and how we give that away. And from from that, I I didn't yet know that I wanted to to be completely unassisted, but I knew that, okay, once I land on what state we're gonna be in, then I'll find midwives in the area, who support home birth and wanting to find a traditional mid midwife knowing the difference between medical midwifery and and traditional midwifery. And so it wasn't until June until we landed here. So I was still thinking, like, I might go unassisted, but I wanna meet who's here and have conversations and see how that lands. And once we got here, I started I actually posted in the Freebird Society and that's what led to connections here on island of, potential midwives and also the specifics on, you know, would you get a birth certificate and how would you navigate having it unassisted or if you're doing your own pregnancy. And because I had the complete guide to free birth course, I had a fully wild pregnancy. And when I contrast the stress and all of the things and the ways that I was beating myself up, none of that happened in the second journey. Like, it was just this journey of trusting, journey of using the the the moments that, you know, fears would come up to, like, notice them, include them, and and reclaim power every time a fear came up. And loved it. Like, people were just yeah. I was in the glow. It the whole journey was I mean, I still had nausea. I still had, this morning sick or, like, all day sickness. It did taper off near the end, but it wasn't meeting me in the same way. It wasn't like this failure. It was it was there was so much power in the pregnancy that I was able to just, like, be with that too. Yeah. And then when we when we got to closer, I met a a midwife here, a traditional midwife who does a lot of work for activism here and the legalities around using that language. And and what I uncovered in that is there was still some parts of me that was believing I had to do a free birth, and it was not rooted in, like, I get to in power. There was some shadow, some things to work through of of, like, railing against. And it was through talking with her that I witnessed that in myself and then got to see, oh, actually, thinking about like feeling into being with you there, I know I want it to just be Rey, Solje and me. And I got to reclaim that and then integrate that. And then I, we were just like on it convinced and we got to nest. There actually was a structure here, so I was like, oh, I don't have to, like, berth in a van or a tent, which I was, like, down for. And we we built a bed. We got it all set. And then our guest date was August ninth. So, like, you know, the whole, like, Lionsgate portal eight eight. Ray and I's anniversary is eight eight. So it's kinda cool that Sol Jae's guest date was around mine, and then Keila's guest date was right around our anniversary. So in my mind, this is one thing I've learned from, like, we'll take into the next pregnancy. I was so believing, like, she was gonna come at the portal. She was gonna come on her guest date, like Solje. So in the mind frame of, like, that's forty weeks, thirty nine weeks, like, I still have at least a week or more. And so we went to the other side of the island on the Oh. It was like, yeah. I definitely won't be doing this, like, next pregnancy. We went to the other side of the island. We were, like, swimming in the beach, and I was, like, taking thirty nine weeks photos and thinking, like, wow. You know, these are the last moments last moon cycle with just Sol jay. And and then, that night, we made it back to our home on this side, just an hour and a half each way. And as soon as we tucked into bed, sensation started. And I was still in the mind frame, like, I still have a week. Like, Ray was like, it could happen. And I'm like, no. I still have a week. And, we went to bed and I was able to. And I woke up and I was like, Ray, like, there was a couple in the night that woke me up, but I was able to sleep. And I had one of the biggest things that I took away from the complete guide was not allowing myself to, like, get all excited and to then use my energy and think it's happening and to really just let it unfold almost to the the point where I was like, it's not even happening. Like, I have all week. And even coming to terms with, like, am I gonna be one of the women who, you know, is with sensations for a week? And so I woke up the next morning and I'm like, yeah, they're still there. I was like, we haven't even gotten everything ready. And it clued into my mind. I'm like, oh, wait, you know, often women like prepare their birthdays, like at least like thirty six weeks, you know, and and have things ready in case the baby comes. And so we went and did errands. I literally this is also something I'm gonna reclaim in the next birth. We went to pick up packages that were a little rolling cart to put like the diaper, the diapers and were knew we were doing, EC. So we had little things that we were picking up and they were synchronistically early. And so we got these things while I was having sensations and, like, being I was in Walmart, and I was, like, so it did feel like the reclaiming from not getting to labor by my choice.
Speaker 4
Yeah.
Speaker 3
And so I was in Walmart and I was just, like, distinctly, like, sitting there with a cart and having one that had me, like, pause and just breathing through with a smile and having people be like, are you okay? Like, having a woman just, like, be happy for no reason freaked people out even though I'm, like, undercover having sensations. So we finished everything. It's and we're like, we should get home, like, just in case because these have still been going on. And we set everything up. We set the towels up. We set candles where we want them. And again, I'm still thinking, like, it's gonna be a week. And so we we blow up the pool. We wanted to have a home birth and or a water birth, and we hadn't tested it yet. So we're like, great. The pool works. We literally deflate it and put it away. And
Speaker 4
That's right. Never to be seen again.
Speaker 3
Well, it's this whole effort to, like, blow it up with the air compressor too, so super loud. So we put it away. And then as I tuck in with Solje, I say to Ray, like, wait. What if it actually is happening and we don't have the pool ready?
Speaker 4
So loud.
Speaker 3
So loud. And so, and she was just going to sleep. So I told him, why don't you take the pool down the road in the truck in the air compressor and blow it up? And so he literally did that. And then it was the first moment that I'm like, okay. I've had all of this training, this practice, this womb work, you know, connecting with my body for this journey. I really wanna be with the sensations now and and meet them. And so I just dropped in and visualized the visualized my womb opening as a rose. And as soon as I did that, I heard this huge pop and was like, what was that? And didn't make the connection what it was. And I was like, well, I do have to pee. Like, I'll just go pee. So I stood up, and then it all gushed, and my water broke. And I was like, oh my gosh. My water broke. And so Ray had literally just left. And so this is, like, ten thirty at night. And so I start texting the women who were my little messaging support to say my water just broke. I think the portal might be open. And then went downstairs, went under the stars. And especially since last time I, you know, wasn't peeing, I just let it release and let the waters release under the stars and and sensation started, right, picking up right away. And before Ray even got back, which was only, like, ten minutes, I started vocalizing. And I had done womb vocalizing before of, like, intentionally connecting to the womb and then allowing sound to match, to meet, and to to breathe through the womb. And so that was a practice that I used to just this is when I shifted and and didn't experience these sensations as pain, but this like electric electric current that just went through every cell and let it go and like let it move through the body and let it go down into the earth again. And but using my voice and just making the weirdest noises and being totally comfortable with that, not caring that the neighbors could hear and thinking, like, what was happening. And then Ray comes back a few minutes later, and he's, like, still looking like he's on a mission. I'm like, okay. My water just broke while you're gone, and I'm already vocalizing. Like, okay. Got it. And then he's like, well, the air compressor didn't work. I'm just gonna fill it in the front, in the truck. I'm like, great. And so we're I'm still thinking I'm having a water birth at this point. And so we go to the front, and, he's trying to fill it up. We hadn't even attached the hose parts that we need because it's an upstairs. And so I'm like, hey, we'll hurry up. I'm like, over the truck, just being with them and really loving it because I was shocked at how fast things were happening. I'm like, I'm already vocalizing. And so then I am like, okay, well, I'm gonna go upstairs. And so I left him and I went upstairs and he was like, I'm gonna throw you the hose. And so I go up to the front of the house and he throws the hose over the railing and I catch it. And as soon as I catch it, I start going into transition. And so I'm clutching the rail and not talking because I'm just so in it and so focused and recognizing I'm standing and I can feel the pressure now and the opening, like she's coming and I don't wanna give birth on the deck, like straight up. And so Ray comes and he doesn't know this yet. He grabs the hose and I'm still frozen there. And he walks in the front and puts it in the tub and then he leaves and was about to walk past me to like, go turn on the tap. And I just grabbed his arm and I'm like, I didn't say anything because I was like in it, just transition, continual sensation, like no space between. And he's like, Hey, I'm gonna go turn on the water. I need to go turn on the water. And then I'm just holding him. And he's like, Okay, so you're saying I'm not gonna turn on the water. And I'm like, and I just keep holding him. And he's like, Okay, so we're not gonna turn that on. All right. And I just like pull him over. He's like, you're you're just in it. It's happening. And I'm like, just still there. And then so, so I muster some breath and, like, need to get to the floor. And so he tries to move me, and I'm just like, mm-mm. Like, no. Yeah. The woman knows her body. She knows exactly how and when she needs to move. And so once I found the space, I turned, I opened the door, and just went straight down to all fours. And I immediately I kind of the same feeling of with SJ. That didn't feel good for me. And so we keep our we kept our yoga ball, like, right by the door. And so I just intuitively laid back on it and just relaxed into this comfort immediately. And I was like, get the towels, get the towels. And so Ray runs. We just put them out, like, literally hours before. And he gets them. He puts them under me, and I was like, tell me the moment that it's it's ready. And so he's like, you're good. You're good. And I was and we had had a camera set up with a tripod and everything. We didn't even get it. I was like, get the phone. Record this. And so he grabs the phone, and we have an eight minute video of her arrival. And so I'm just laying back on the yoga ball with my my legs out, knees open, and just totally, like, resting. Because now I knew I wasn't standing. And the contrast of the two births, I I remember going into it, like, I'm just gonna see what pushing is like. I know what coach pushing was. I I've I've learned through other women's stories that women can listen intuitively to when and how to push. And so I'm gonna play with that and see what that's like and recognize if I don't feel the need, I'm not going to. And I never had the need or desire to push. And so I just laid there. And the video, I'm just breathing these really deep breaths and just, again, allowing every sensation to then just move me and breathe her as well as intuitively felt her breathe me. And it's six minutes within the video of just breathing, and then you notice when a sensation happens, there's, like, some movement in my face, and it's just, like, allowing the sensation and the pulse to move through breath. And then I look down and I just see, like, slowly, she just starts emerging. And I just keep breathing and Ray's in the video and Solje just she had just woken up during transition. She had been asleep the whole time and then woke up during transition. And Ray was explaining to her while he's recording, like, baby's coming. And he's like, you came this way. And she she's just watching the whole thing and she's like, wow. Baby's coming and I came that way. And and Ray's like, you look divine, mama. You look like a goddess. And I'm just laying there. And there's actually smiles. And again, the contrast of being told, like, you're still smiling. And so the in one breath, the her head came out and it was just her head and she was laying there. And Ray asked me, like, are you gonna catch her? Are you gonna catch her? And I just laid there and I knew that I wanted him to. And so he's like, well, I'm gonna go wash my hands. He gives the phone to Solje and he runs over to to wash his hands, like, because he had been doing the air compressing and all that. And he comes back and Solje is like taping her toes being like, you hold the phone. You hold the phone. And all you hear is, like, the next gush, and the baby came out. And so we don't actually have her emerging. We have Solje's toes. And then he takes the phone back, and you get the the mo the first moments of me holding her. And she was pink, and she wasn't crying. She was just there. And the guide had, again, in the stories had assured me that we can land on Earth in a peaceful way. And I just kept rubbing her back saying, mama's here. And then she had a first, like, squawky cry, and both Ray and I were just lit up. And, yeah, and it it was that easy in in six minutes of just laying back, breathing.
Speaker 4
And tell me about the placenta.
Speaker 3
Right. So minutes later, again, the same time frame, you know, mine was scraped out of me. We I I noticed that the, the afterbirth pains happening right away, And I told Ray, okay. Get the bowl. Get the bowl. He ran, got the bowl. And I had the intuitive nudge that of, like, the slightest push. It's like, I feel like if I actually just let go, it's just gonna come out. But I actually held to wait for the bowl. And when the bowl was there and he told me it was good, I did the slightest twinge, and it was like, and it was out.
Speaker 4
Mhmm. And
Speaker 3
it was that easy. And then I got to later like, you know, four days later, I communed with the placenta and, yeah, and we got to bury it out back right behind here and have a whole ritual.
Speaker 4
So good. Yeah. I love the image of you smiling, just laying back. I was not smiling. I can't relate at all, but I love that you did it.
Speaker 3
And I I know that's not gonna be it's not every story, but that that's
Speaker 4
the story. Hell, yeah. And it's it's on the gorgeous spectrum of what's possible. You know? It's so beautiful. I can totally picture it. And then the baby the little girl's toes. That's so cute. Oh, so redemptive. Amazing. And then you go on to just have the best life ever on Big Island and be an RBK and be this beautiful mama. And so who if you were if you were to summarize in a sentence or two, you know, who you are now with this birth at your back, what would you say?
Speaker 3
Yeah. I just have unshakable faith in your one on one relationship with the universe that you can tune inward and trust your body and trust your experience and move from that place even if the external is saying completely otherwise. Mhmm.
Speaker 4
Yeah. Beautiful. Well, thank you. Thank you for your time.
Speaker 3
Thank you for allowing me to share.
Speaker 2
And that's it for today, my sisters. Check out everything we do, including one on one and group coaching. Learn about our private membership, in person retreats, and more on free birth society dot com. Our online courses are on free birth society courses dot com, including our flagship course, the complete guide to free birth. Don't miss the radical birth keeper school if you're ready to become the authentic midwife that women are searching for. Together we rise, and the revolution starts inside each of us. I'll leave you with our free birth society theme song, Wild Woman by Aruba Red.
Speaker 5
I honor you for the wisdom you held, the ancient traditions of plant medicine and womb magic. I feel the spirit of the ancestors as I place my hands upon my belly. This sacred portal will be honored. Eons upon light beams of survival, withstanding the eradication of our power by design. I will not allow the separation of our young to be forced upon me. My sisters will no longer birth in captivity. The picket line redefined from burning our wild women to paralyzing us and drugging out babes. Strapped down in a clinical white bed, drying up the milk from our breasts, keep your needles. My family will never again be doomed to chase those dragons or your poison. We reject your fear. We choose love. Everything with intention. Death, ascension. I will fly and bring her back to the star.
