Speaker 0
Into the wild, I'm going into the wild, I am. It's been a wild freedom child, since I left my roots back home. Into the wild I'm good. Into the wild I am. It's been a while, freedom child, since I left my roots back home.
Speaker 1
Welcome to the Free Birth Society podcast. This is a radical space for women who are ready to celebrate their autonomous choices in birth, motherhood, and beyond. Together, we'll learn about wild birth through personal narrative, we'll explore the politics of birth, and we'll analyze everything that relates to our lives as women from a feminist perspective. Here's your host, Emilee Saldaya.
Speaker 0
It's been a wild freedom since I've left my rules back home.
Speaker 2
Today, Radical Birthkeeper School graduate, Jess Owens from Canada, joins me on the show sharing her two birth stories. Jess started her mothering journey with a seemingly acceptable midwife attended home birth in England. And although there were things that left a bad taste in her mouth, Jess felt lucky to birth at home without complications. After a few international moves and learning more about physiological birth, she and her family moved to Canada, and Jess began attending births outside of the system. Jess became pregnant again and enrolled in the RBK school, all while building community and a flourishing birthkeeping business entirely by word-of-mouth. She goes on to birth her son in total power, as did so many other women from her cohort. Jess offers a beautiful story of trust and the incredible ripple effect that taking birth back into the hands of women creates. Here at Free Birth Society, we are always seeking new ways to share the magic of free birth with more women who deserve to know these truths. And you may have heard about an exciting project we've had in the works for a while now, our Free Birth YouTube channel. It is so close to being complete, we only need a few more videos before we go live. So if you have a free birth video that you'd like to share for the education of women and families around the world, please submit your story to us. I'm also excited to share that I will be conducting the first of its kind free birth research study to produce some real hard numbers around the true nature of sovereign birth. And I'm looking for a professional researcher to consult with on this project. If that is you, please reach out. I'm going to need all the help I can get. One last thing. If you haven't grabbed our free burst starter kit yet, what are you even doing? If you're listening to this podcast, the free burst starter kit is for you. It's totally free, and it includes over three hours of direct teachings from me on all the basics of free birth. What is it? Why do women do it? Is it safe? The big what ifs, placenta and cord care, and of course, so much more. You'll also get a huge ebook that we made full of inspiring sovereign birth stories written in the words of the mothers themselves and a guide to our top podcast episodes for preparing yourself for free birth. This is an invaluable resource to any woman and thousands of women have already claimed it. Again, it's totally free. So just head over to free birth society dot com slash starter kit opt in to grab it. Okay. Let's get into Jess's story. Alright. Welcome to the show, Jess.
Speaker 3
Thank you. Happy to be
Speaker 2
Yeah. I'm excited to have you because, obviously, you were in a previous round of RBK, but I didn't get to, like, really hear your whole story. And you were pregnant during that round, and so this is really fun to reconnect after your free birth. So I first have to ask, you're from New Brunswick, Canada, but are you connected to YO at all? Like, that's such a small area. Right.
Speaker 3
So it's actually kinda funny. I'm not originally from here. So we moved here, about three years ago, and we moved here about a month after Yo left.
Speaker 2
No.
Speaker 3
I know. I was so disappointed, and I actually randomly found her through some, like, Rona stuff. I hadn't even heard of her at this point three years ago. And I found her, and she was just telling the story of how she left New Brunswick. And I'm like, you left. And then I put the pieces together that she was involved with birth and then yeah, so really funny, but also sad. I know so many of so many people that know Yo and worked with Yo, because New Brunswick is a really small place. So
Speaker 2
And so you're both a free birther now and, also, you do birth work outside the system. Mhmm.
Speaker 3
Yes.
Speaker 2
So I wanna hear it all. Who are you when you start doing that? Are you a birth worker first and then become a mom? Or just what is what is the story of just getting into all of this?
Speaker 3
Okay. Yeah. I I was a mother first before I got into birth work. That's what kind of, opened the door to that for me for sure. So I guess yeah. I mean, before I was a mother, I was, I was a a traveling, very transient person. So for my husband, my husband's work, he, we moved around a lot. So we lived in Europe for a while. We lived in the States before that. And we were just moving around quite frequently. And then that kind of just became a huge part of our life was not only moving around but also traveling. So we would travel for fun and also for for his work as well. And, we were just loving life as a young, married couple. And there was a a time period where we weren't even sure if kids were gonna be on the table.
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
And I think deep down for me, it was like they were. They were going to be a part of our future, but at that time, we were just enjoying being so free. And then, yeah, we'll we'll skip ahead, I guess, to around twenty eighteen. My husband and I had went down to Peru, and, maybe you're already gonna guess where this is going. But,
Speaker 2
let me guess what you did.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. So he had gone a few years earlier to do Ayahuasca alone, and he did a solo trip there. And then, in twenty eighteen, we went we went together for a week long retreat in Iquitos. And, my first ceremony night, so our first night at the retreat, was like a was like a blast off. Right? It was crazy. It was intense. So many things. But one of the big things that happened for me during that ceremony was I just, like, looked down at my womb. I was very, like, folded over. Like, my body was, like, folded over most of the journey. And I just looked towards my womb, and I it was just, like, vibrating and, like, blowing. And, I'm sure this is a common thing for a lot of women, but I had always had this thought in my head, like, what if I can't? What if I can't have kids? You know? I think society kind of, like, puts that into our head a little bit, like, that we're broken and, like, it's it's gonna be hard.
Speaker 2
You think? Yes. I
Speaker 3
do think so.
Speaker 2
Where do you get that from? Yeah.
Speaker 3
So that was definitely a narrative that ran through my mind throughout my life, really. Just this, like, glimmer of, like, oh, what if? What if? You know? And so in that moment, I looked down at my womb. It was glowing, vibrating, and the message I got was, girl, you're good. You're so good. Like, you are the epitome of fertility. Like, you turn this on, and you're gonna get a baby. I was like, okay. Message received. So after that trip, well, actually, after the retreat, we're still in Peru for a bit. I was talking to my husband about that, and I was like, I think I'm like, I'm feeling, oh, like, I'm ready. I'm ready. And he's like, I'm not. I'm not. And I'm like, oh, but I am. And at this point, he was kind of, transitioning out of his career. So he played hockey for many, many years, and that's why we were traveling around. And, he was kinda trans starting to transition out or thinking about his transition out. And he was of the mindset, well, like, let's just wait a little bit. And I know him, and I'm like, there's never gonna be a good time. Like, there you're never going to to say, okay. I'm ready because, like, the transition out of hockey and that transition has happened now. So now we know, that's quite the transition, and it's not a quick one. Right? So it takes time as well. So, anyway, after some some talking and really getting into it about, you know, my true feelings, like, I'm really ready, and I think I think I feel this call for a reason. You know? So he agreed, and, I got pregnant, like, a week after we got back from Peru. So that was spring of twenty eighteen. It was, like, first try. And so that was a bit of a surprise for us, for sure. Right. Even though I had that experience of, like, you're good, it was still happened quite quickly. Right? So that was a bit of a surprise. But it was great. We were living in so we spent off seasons from hockey in Toronto, Canada. And, so we were there at the time. We spent summer there, and he was gonna be going to a new place. He signed, he was checking out a few different countries, few different teams. One of them, I think this is relevant to say, was, the Czech Republic. And, so, of course, when we get word of this, like, oh, they're interested, like, you know, maybe we'll talk contract blah blah blah. I'm like, okay. I'm gonna, like, check out the climate there of birth. You know? I'm pregnant. This is a foreign country. C section rate there is, like, through the roof, like, very, very, very, very high. Birth centers are not a thing. Home birth is not a thing. And I was just like, oh, this sounds no good. So we for other reasons too, but we were like, no. For for there. And, anyway, he ended up signing contract in England.
Speaker 2
So So were you sounds like you were already oriented towards, like, somewhat of an alternative birth, but how how alternative? Like, how what did you know, if anything, at this point?
Speaker 3
So I I would say that, in my life or, like, in my adult life, I had really avoided doctors and, chose, you know, more of, like, natural remedies. Like, if I could do something at home first, I would. I really tried to avoid doctors at all costs. Just didn't I didn't have, like, anyone experience that, you know, made that so. It was just it was just an intuition thing, I guess. And, yeah, so that was already kind of my my, my viewpoint. And but, honestly, I hadn't really had too many people close to me who had chose, a home birth, at all. And I wasn't even sure at that point if I wanted a home birth because we didn't have a home. We didn't know where we were going. I had a friend who had birth in a birth center who had a good experience, so that was definitely on the table for wherever we were gonna go. Yeah. I would say I hospital was like it didn't seem like the place for me for sure.
Speaker 2
So you guys choose England?
Speaker 3
Yeah. We choose England, and we leave, to go to England in early August. So I'm about sixteen weeks pregnant at that point. And as soon as I get there, so there's a team doctor. So they know I'm pregnant. So the team doctor doctor sets me up with a midwife because in England, that's, like, the default is a midwife. If you have, like, a high risk pregnancy or, I guess, if you choose to, you could go, with an OB. But generally speaking, default is midwife. But then you do have your choice of where where you want to give birth, whether it be in the hospital. They had the city that we were in, they had what was called this is so silly. A midwife led unit, and it's just a wing of a hospital. Like, it's nothing. And they call it that's, like, their version of, like, a birth center, but it was attached to the hospital. So it's, like, not anything like that, or you could give birth at home. And since we were in this home, this apartment, this house, it didn't feel like ours. It was, you know, furniture that wasn't ours, which we're very used to having, you know, having been in this lifestyle for a while. But this year was a bit different. Right? And I wanted eventually probably to nest a bit. We were gonna be there for a few months after the baby was born before we went back to Canada. But still, it just didn't feel like home. And I think that was my reasoning for because I did make a a decision kind of. I was like, okay. I guess I choose the midwife led unit.
Speaker 2
Question.
Speaker 3
Yes.
Speaker 2
Or statement. That is less like home, though.
Speaker 3
I know.
Speaker 2
Like, where where you sleep at night is way more it is your literal home
Speaker 4
Yeah.
Speaker 2
Even for a short time.
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 2
And a birth center or fake birth center or whatever, inarguably, is way less familiar. So what was the real reason?
Speaker 3
Yeah. Good question. I think my husband had some reservations about me giving birth at home. Not for the safety factor, not because he had fear. He's not a feel fearful person at all. He's very supportive. But he was like so we lived in an apartment complex, and literally, like, the person above me was a teammate of his. And he's like, what if you're loud? What if it's this? And I'm like, I don't think that's an issue. Like, I really don't. And he was, like, hesitant. He was very hesitant. He wasn't like, no. We're not doing that or, like, I don't think we should do that. He was just hesitant. So there that came into play too. And when I was around six months pregnant, I had a talk with them. I'm like, hey. I don't like the midwife led unit. It's ugly. It's not it like, the pictures because you couldn't see it. I wasn't allowed to, like, go see it. Oh my god. I wasn't allowed to go see it. Red flag. Yeah. All all the pictures online of it looked sterile. It looked like a hospital room with, like, an exercise ball and, like
Speaker 2
You mean it looked like exactly what it was? Yeah.
Speaker 3
It was horrible. It was horrible. And I was like, I can't. I can't do it. So we decided, okay, home birth. But that was pretty late. My pregnancy is, like, around six months, so I jumped ahead of it. But I get this midwife I get assigned a midwife who is on, sick leave. So I get assigned her, but I don't have her. I don't see her.
Speaker 2
Well I'm like,
Speaker 3
why is that that makes no sense. Why would I be assigned someone who's not currently working right now? So I end up seeing multiple midwives, someone different every appointment, and it's just like, there's no, like, personal connection at all throughout those appointments. I'm just a pay a name on a piece of paper. They're just looking down, like, barely giving me eye contact. It was not the prenatal care that I had hoped for at all. It was, yeah, I didn't enjoy my appointments. My appointments were at a, general practice family doctor's office. I'm sitting in a room with a bunch of sick people. You know? I'm, like, glowing, thriving, feeling great, and I'm surrounded by sick people and having to go see this midwife who doesn't care about me.
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
So that was not fun. That was not fun at all. So for some, like, I wanted a little bit of continuity. I also wanted someone who was more familiar with the system than I was. So I hired a doula, and, she was great. She was really great. You know, answer she had attended more home than hospital at that point. She was lovely. She was very but she was a doula. It's still in the system. Right? So, she answered questions that we had and, yeah, I'm really glad that that we had her. And, I, yeah, I wanted a water birth. So we had, rented the pool from them and,
Speaker 2
oh,
Speaker 3
I I will say this. So around, like, thirty around the time I decided to have a home birth, one of the midwives, had kind of made a comment like, oh, like, that's great. Like, I could just tell she was, she had no faith in me. Oh. Because, like, as the story goes, first time moms who choose a home birth, they're just gonna transfer. Like
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
They're not gonna it's not gonna work. But, like, that's great. Mhmm. So that's how I that's the vibe I got throughout the my visits with the the midwives. I ended up having I measured small twice, so they ended up saying that I needed an additional ultrasound, which at the time, I didn't know anything about ultrasounds and the harms of ultrasound. But even in that, I was like, really? Do I have to? Like, I I feel fine. Like, I think everything's okay. Better safe to be sore better safe than sorry. Mhmm. Just like a very condescending, like, be a good girl. Like, just go do it. So I did. And, actually, my anatomy scan, they had trouble seeing something on the head, with her head, my daughter's head. So they scheduled an additional I had, like, I think, four or five ultrasounds, which now I just cringe at that. Yeah. So that was basically my pregnancy. And
Speaker 2
Yeah. Take us into the into the birth.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So I was about thirty nine. I was almost forty weeks. I was, like, thirty nine in some days. And, for that whole week leading up to the birth, I in the evenings, I would feel some sensations. And, they would last for the evening, and then they would go away. And it happened, like, three or four nights that way. And they were just very mild, almost just like a tightening. And so I knew that we were building up to something, and then it came to a Friday. And I woke up that morning kinda just feeling like something was different, even though I wasn't having sensations that morning. They did start in the afternoon, but, again, very mild, just some some light tightening. And, I was going about my day just running a few errands, getting some last minute things for the birth. And then around five PM, I came home. And I thought, you know what? I've been kinda running around all day. Why don't I just, like, sit down on the couch and see if the stillness brings anything up? So sure enough, I sat down on the couch and just relaxed for a bit, and things started to pick up a little bit and just become a little bit more consistent. I was definitely more aware of, the feeling of, the contractions in in my uterus. And then that evening, my husband and I were just, like, getting kind of excited. You know? We were hanging out on the couch, and, I was on the birth ball, and things were, like, picking up for sure. And I could feel the, almost like the crescendo of the birth the con contraction, like, where it starts, it builds, and then it loses momentum and then fades again. And then, around ten o'clock, we decided that we would go to bed because I thought, oh, we should get some sleep. And, as soon as I, like, laid down in bed, I was like, okay. I'm not I'm not gonna sleep. So I got up and, just did, like I lit a candle in the bedroom, just did, like, some hip circles, and, like, I was on my knees kinda over the bed. And at this point, I was, like, breathing through them and, could not could not lay down, could not sit still. And my husband kinda noticed, and he's like, would you wanna get in the bathtub? So I decided, yeah, that's a great idea. So I got in the bathtub, and I wasn't in there for very long, maybe, like, twenty minutes or so. And I didn't wanna be alone, so I called for him. He came in there and sat with me, and things seemed to, like, pick up quite quickly. And my sensations were, like, only a few minutes apart at that point. So this is probably about, oh, I don't know, maybe, like, close to midnight. And we decided to call my doula just to let her know what was happening. And, she asked if I wanted her to come, And, I said, yeah. I want you to come. I think you should come. So she came. She didn't live too far, so she was there within a half an hour. And something I'll never forget about this is so I'm in the dark in the bathroom. There's a candle, and she comes in, and she doesn't say a word. Like, I'm clearly in it. She just sits down next to the tub, and just her presence being there was so comforting. And, yeah, I'll never forget how she entered my space. It was just so respectful. And, I was really glad to have a a feminine energy there and someone that I had gotten to know over the course of my pregnancy, so I felt, you know, relatively comfortable with her. And then she sat with me for a few sensations, and she made the comment, you know, I actually don't think it's too soon to call the midwives. And I was like, oh, really? Like, okay. So my husband called, and, they wanna talk to me on the phone because they wanna, like, hear how I sound, whether it's, like, worth it for them to come and whatever. So I'm going through a sensation when they wanna talk to me. So they're, like, hearing that. I'm pretty vocal at that point, like, definitely breathing through them heavily. And then I speak to them, and they're like, yeah. Okay. We'll come. So no idea who's coming. Right? It's like the luck of the draw. Could be someone that I've seen, those many midwives that I saw throughout my pregnancy, or it could be someone totally new.
Speaker 2
So you call, like, a, like, a hotline and they dispatch somebody?
Speaker 3
Yes. Exactly. Trip. Yeah. So the NHS, it's all, NHS midwives. They're all, you know, connected, I guess. So it depends who's on call that night. So turns out it's a complete stranger. Yeah. So she comes in and right away can you get out of the tub so I can check you? Ew. Right away. Right away. And I was like, like, I did not wanna get out. I was comfortable in there. I was doing well in there. My deal was like, can you check her in here? Can you just check her in here? No. She has to come out. And it that was like, okay. Great. Good start. And the energy of this midwife, I wasn't feeling her. Like, she was, yeah, I don't know. Just wasn't feeling her. And so we got out, go into the living room. I get on the couch to, like, lay down somehow, which, like, I don't wanna do at all. Laying down just, yeah, felt horrible. So she texts me, and she says that I'm three centimeters. And so that's, like, kind of surprising based on, like, my contractions, I guess, and just, like, how I was feeling. But, again, it's my first time. I don't know. So that number means everything to me. You know? That number means it means everything, at that point. So I've decided to just hang out in the living room at that point. I don't get back in the bathtub.
Speaker 2
And what's the vibe of the response? Like, the midwives discovering that you're three.
Speaker 3
I don't really remember it being super pronounced, so maybe that means there wasn't much of a reaction. I don't remember her being, like, disappointed or anything by that. Yeah. So, but she did she did make a point of saying because by this point, my husband had set up the pool. He hadn't put water in it yet, but he got everything ready to go. So she did make a comment to say, not yet with the pool because we gotta wait until you're five.
Speaker 2
Okay. Okay.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So I was like, okay. But you've just made me get out of the bathtub where it was really comfortable. And now you're saying you can't get in the pool. Like, okay.
Speaker 2
Someone someone showed up to be in charge.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Oh, for sure. Yeah. Definitely. And, it's funny. Looking back, I'll just comment this that the midwives were they felt just, like, annoying. Like, I wanted to like like, they were flies that I wanted to swat away, and they just kept taking me out and taking me out and taking me out.
Speaker 2
I mean, you basically just described medical midwifery.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Oh, totally. They're just annoying.
Speaker 2
Yeah.
Speaker 3
They don't leave you alone.
Speaker 2
On a good day, they're annoying. Right. On a bad day, they're a lot worse.
Speaker 3
Yes. That's true. And I can talk more about that later because I have an opinion about the whole, you know, thing. But, anyways, so at that point, I'm, like, just trying to get comfortable. I'm in the living room. I do go on the bed for a bit, like, propped up in pillows. I'm on my side. I'm standing up. I remember having a sensation while standing, like, holding on to my doula, and it was really, really intense. And after looking to her as an authority for sure and saying, oh, that was really big. Do you think I should stand up for the next one so, like, more happens? You know? Like, it's more, efficient. And she's, like, good on her. She's like, you could or you could do something else. Like, she didn't say anything, you know, to me. So, anyways, a lot of back and forth, a lot of different positions. And then she checks me again, and I am like I think I'm five. And then she says, okay. You can get in the pool now. So I get in the pool, and it's such a relief. Like, the the hot water was just such a made me relax, made me feel really comfortable. So I stayed in there for quite some time, although I was kind of in and out often. And, and, yeah, time's a bit blurry, but I I go on laboring for quite some time, and then I do start to feel the urge to push. And I just kinda start pushing. And she's asking me the midwife is asking me, are you doing that, or do you feel like you or you feel the urge to push? I didn't really understand the question. I was kind of like and then I had a sensation, so I wasn't able to answer her. And then my next break, I was like, no. No. Like, I'm not doing that. It's just, like, happening. But what a weird question to ask.
Speaker 2
What a weird question. Can you imagine asking a woman that? No. Are you doing that? It's so dumb. Yeah. So it's just like how many ways does she not trust you?
Speaker 3
Mhmm. Mhmm. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. Because she she didn't know how, if I was at a ten at that point.
Speaker 2
She hadn't had her fingers inside you recently. Yeah. Yeah. Of course. Yeah. So She has no other skill set to figure out or not not even figure out to to lean into where you may be as if it even matters. That's the other, like, just stupid part about this, you know, and about medical mbuphyry. What's it matter? Mhmm. It only matters in the context of your arbitrary rules and regulations. That's it.
Speaker 3
Mhmm. And that question, for sure, when she posed that question, I was like, oh, uh-oh.
Speaker 2
Right. Makes you heady.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So but there was no controlling it either. Like, I was so it was just the weird thing of, like, my body is doing it, but, like, should I ease up a bit or, like, whatever? So I I'm pushing, and my I was pushing for probably, like, two and a half hours. And at that point, I think she was or as time is progressing, she's probably, you know, looking at her watch and being like, ugh. It's taking a while. Like, what's going on? She had checked me again, and I was ten. So, yeah, I was just continuing to push. I was in and out of the pool. I at this point, I had gotten out of the pool. My doula was behind me, kinda supporting me, and I was and then I was I was trying to push too because I was like, okay. I just want this to be over. So I was also, you know, putting in some effort there too. And, my waters hadn't released at this point. So my, you could see right before my daughter emerged, you could see, like, my the bag of waters kind of, like, bulging, and then her head was behind it. I didn't see it. My husband said that's what it looked like. And, the midwives so by this time, there's two midwives there because they call an additional one when the baby's about to be born. In the second one, her energy was just a little softer, and I appreciated her presence there. So then they they made a comment, like, about breaking my waters because they thought maybe that was making it harder for for my daughter to come out. And, I had a quick, like you know, I'm in the throes of it, but I'm asking, my doula, like, what do you think? Like and she's like, you've done everything up until this point yourself. Like, I think you can do it. And I'm like, yeah. I can do it. Like, I can do it. And then the next push, she was born and her beg burst as she emerged. And she was kinda like I was on all fours, so she kind of, landed on the floor. And my arms were, like, jello from, like, leaning up against the chair for so long. So I did ask for help. I'm like, help. Help. And they helped me. The midwives helped me bring her to my chest. And,
Speaker 2
So if that's an interesting point because if they hadn't have been there, I would have grabbed her. Just picked up your baby, which is fine too. You know?
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2
Interesting. These, like, little these little pieces.
Speaker 3
Mhmm. For sure. Or, like, she would've just hung out there for a quick second. You know? But there was, like, this sense of, like, for sure, them, they would've thought, grab your baby. Like, But she could've hung out there for a quick second while I just, you know, snapped out of it and and grabbed her on my chest. But, anyway, she came onto my chest. We knew she was a girl, so we had chosen to to find out her sex. And but, yeah, that moment was insane. I just remember looking at her, looking at my husband, and being like, it's you. It's me. Like, it's her. It's you and me. And that was such a special moment. And just being able to see his reaction, but then I also have this, like because, you know, the memory just plays in your head. I have this memory of, like, people
Speaker 2
The gnats.
Speaker 3
Like, around. Yeah. Like, get away. So they were very close to me during that time. They definitely didn't back up and give space. My husband was the furthest probably away from me. He was, you know, giving me space and just watching and observing. So that was interesting. And then, I wanted delayed cord clamping. That was part of my birth plan. So delayed cord clamping to them was about, like, maybe three minutes.
Speaker 2
That sucks.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So, they cut her cord, and then I just, you know, sat there with her just, like, looking at her. And then they were like, okay. You know, it's time for the placenta. I don't really know how long it was later. I they did not give me Pitocin. I stood up, though, and that just made it easier for me, and it came right out. It was pretty easy.
Speaker 2
That's why they didn't give you Pitocin.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. And then, they left within, I don't know, an hour and a half or something. And yeah. So for that birth, I really consider myself lucky. Like, super lucky. Right? Because I fell within the parameters pretty much of what's acceptable for for them, for the midwives, for the system. And had I gone, you know, past forty two weeks or, if my pushing pushing stage was, like, longer than it was or
Speaker 2
Yeah.
Speaker 3
A million things. So many things could have went a different direction. So in the grand scheme of things, I just consider myself lucky now. And, yeah, it was a pretty okay birth.
Speaker 4
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
Right? Just some gnats. Yeah. Some some real gnats.
Speaker 2
So how does how does this birth shape you and take me into where your birth work begins?
Speaker 3
Mhmm. So at that time, I don't really see everything that I just explained to you. Okay. And I kind of frame it as like, yeah, that was the hardest thing in my life. There was a little few things, like, that did stand out, like the the getting out of the bathtub thing. I was like, oh, that's kinda could've stayed in the bathtub. But, overall, I thought that birth was, like, the pinnacle and, like, amazing home birth. You know? I got to be in the water. It was natural because I didn't have any medication. Yeah. I really had, you know, positive things to say about the experience. And it was at that point where I was considering birth work.
Speaker 2
Mhmm.
Speaker 3
And, now I was a new mother, so I was navigating that as well. And the first year of my daughter's life, we continued to be very transient. So we when she was three months old, we went back to Canada and planned to kinda start our life. That was gonna be my my husband's last year of playing hockey. So, he was gonna transition into something new. Wasn't really sure what that was. We were giving ourselves some time for him to figure that out. We were gonna be living in Toronto. Yeah, just, like, exciting, setting up this new life. And then we got this call, from this hockey team in Australia, and they do have hockey in Australia, but it's not very popular. The it's they don't have a professional league, but they have a pretty good, like, pretty good league where, like, people pay to go see the the players and whatnot. They called him. They were like, come, please. Like, we want we want you to play here for the season, and their season is switched. Right? So it would have just been starting in the summer because they're winter. And so we have this three month old. We've just gotten back to Canada, and we get this opportunity because we get, like, all expenses paid, like, a beautiful apartment in downtown Melbourne. And we're like, yeah. We can't really pass that up. So we go to Australia for, like, four months. Fun. Yeah. It's fun, but I'm also, like, alone. Like Yeah. You know, in motherhood. I'm not near my closest friend. I'm not near my family. So that was tricky. That was pretty tricky, for sure. And I remember during during that mothering year, though, I also remember so badly wanting, like, a wise woman or, like, some guidance in my life, because all of the opinions I was getting around, you know, my daughter's sleep and, how much I hold her and, like, just all this stuff was, like, not in alignment with me. But I was still looking for some guidance, and I didn't have that. So that first year of mothering was kinda hard. And then, you know, I find my groove, and I realized, okay. I have to not pay attention to what everyone else is saying or doing and just kinda, like, go within. And that made mothering a lot easier for sure. And then, you know, eventually, I I did find my community of women who are amazing. So yeah. Then after well, my daughter's like we we get home for to Canada after Australia. My husband still, he decides to do, like, a a boot camp for coding, so he's gonna get into, like, computers. And, we're staying with his parents and, which is comes with his own challenges with the baby. And then, anyway, he gets a job in Toronto, so then we get our own apartment there. And this is, like, the beginning of the next chapter. He gets that job in February of twenty twenty.
Speaker 2
Oh.
Speaker 3
So a month later, we all know what happens. And,
Speaker 2
Dun dun dun.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So this is and this is an apprenticeship too. So this is a six month paid apprenticeship. So he's gonna getting be getting, like, mentored, in the office, like a really cool start up. And then he gets sent to work at home and doesn't get the mentorship. We're in a one bedroom apartment with a one year old, so he's on, like, Zoom meetings. Like, there's nowhere for him to go. So we were like, k. This isn't working. We gotta get out of here. We need more space. We need outdoor space. We didn't really have outdoor space. Parks were closing in Toronto. It was crazy. So we went back to live with his parents for a bit to, like, regroup. He was working from home, so it didn't matter that he wasn't we we were in, Niagara Falls, with his parents. So, anyway, we're, like, trying to figure our life out, trying to figure out where we're gonna live, and his internship ends. They don't hire him on again. So he's without a job, but, like, we're fine. He's just kinda, like, looking, maybe gonna go out on his own, and we decide we do not wanna go back to Toronto. It's really expensive there. Let's look for something else, but it's also quite expensive in our hometown of Niagara Falls as well. Where can we go? So then we start looking, and New Brunswick is one of the most affordable provinces in Canada. So we're like, let's just go there. Like, why not? So, friends of ours had moved here just before us, so we would have have some friends there. So we bought a house here. We didn't see the house before we bought it. We just, it was, like, sight unseen. Like, our realtor FaceTimed us, took a video. We're like, yeah. That'll do. So, we bought this house that we're currently in, and we moved to New Brunswick. And it was around this time after we got settled, that I was starting to think of, like, okay. I think I'd like to start, you you know, working outside the home again. I was a yoga teacher prior to becoming a mom, so I was, you know, teaching a lot of yoga. I hadn't really gotten back into that. I was feeling a call for something different. And throughout that time, I was still kind of devouring, like, birth stuff. I was reading birth books. I hadn't discovered the Free Birth Society yet, but I was just, like, eating it all up, right, and thinking I was gonna become a doula. So February of, twenty twenty one, I signed up for a a doula training with a big, you know, organization. And, I kid you not, the night before the doula training starts, I found Free Birth Society. The night before. Ma'am. And I was, like, so, like, wow.
Speaker 2
That's funny.
Speaker 3
I was, like, you know, just looking at your Instagram posts, and I hadn't even listened to a podcast at that point. But I found because I found Yo, and then I found you, And then I found, you know, just all of your work, and I was like, oh, this is amazing. And then I had the thought. I'm like, am I is this am I making, like, the wrong choice here the night before? And then I'm like, oh, I'm already signed up. Like, just just do it. So this is still COVID era. So, yeah, I do the doula training. Realize it's not in alignment at all, so I don't continue to get certified. I just, like, stop and, like, whatever. So I just start devouring the podcast and then, realize that, like, I feel this call to bring in another baby. Mhmm. And, I wasn't sure. We weren't sure if we were gonna be having another baby, but I I really felt this I actually felt the, like, very male energy of this spirit coming through. And, my husband was not on board. So, again, we had to kinda work through that. And, he was then in agreement, and we conceived, in the spring of, twenty twenty two. And then at around six weeks, that pregnancy released. And, yeah, I wasn't sad. It it wasn't like a sadness. It was just like, oh, okay. This is like a there was some disappointment for sure, but it was I didn't sit in that for too long, and I was like, okay. Let's try again. Like, no big deal. I know nothing's wrong. Like, it's just a little trial run. And then I got pregnant the very next ovulation. So literally two weeks after I had, released that pregnancy, I got pregnant again. And immediately, knew, you know, this was gonna be way different. By that point, I had I had attended birth. Right? So I had been attending births outside of the system in New Brunswick. The women were asking for it, so it was a true call from my community. And, I didn't do the doula thing, so I was like, you know what? This is what I'm gonna do. And I had attended a few births by that point, by the time I had gotten pregnant myself. And so free birth, it was definitely you know, that's how it was
Speaker 2
So, excuse me. So, I mean, I think for a lot of women, they can't comprehend how a woman goes from thinking she'll be a doula, saying no to that, and then somehow finding women to attend outside the system. Is there anything to say about, like, that bridge? Because, like, yeah, what what did you do? How did you put yourself out there? How did those women find you? How was it just through your social network?
Speaker 3
Yeah. It was definitely through my social network. I had found I had been in contact through a homeschooling, group, a woman who used to attend birth here outside of the system who was no longer. Oh.
Speaker 4
And
Speaker 3
then when she found out that I was on the, like, doula path, but was like, it's not really working. She was like, oh, okay. I'll keep you in mind if I hear of anyone, and I'll send them your way. And I'm like, okay. So then a woman contacted me.
Speaker 2
Nice.
Speaker 3
It was my first birth, and I was like, sure. Like, yeah. We can do this. I was a little hesitant. She's like she's like, oh, no. I want you at my birth. I can tell. Like, I she's like, I want you. And I was like, okay. Let's do it. And it went amazing. That was my first birth. It went so, so well. And, they they just kept coming. Right. They just do. Like, it's word-of-mouth only. Like, by that point, there was no advertising or anything. So, yeah, I was and I I was attending birth throughout this pregnancy as well. I knew it was gonna be a wild pregnancy for sure. So I had also so got pregnant August. In October, I signed up for RBK school. So I did the school, in the winter leading into the spring, and, we finished in April. I was, you know, gonna be expecting around middle to end of May. So I had a little time there to, just chill after the school. The school was amazing. Such a great thing to do while you're pregnant too. And there were so many of us pregnant right around the same time. There was, like, baby one week, another baby, another baby, another baby. It was so cool.
Speaker 2
So cool.
Speaker 3
So, yeah, my pregnancy was, like, super easy breezy. Like, I was just in full trust. My husband was super onboard. I he knew so much about birth, but and, like, birth outside the system, free birth by that point because I was just, like, you know, telling him stuff all the time. He was like, yeah. Of course. Let's go. And there was only one moment of that pregnancy. I was about thirty six weeks, and I was like I had been palpating myself, and I had been using the fetoscope, kinda unsuccessfully. Like, I got it a couple times. Most times, I was listening to the placenta, and and I knew I was. And I was like, okay. So around thirty six weeks, I was like, is this baby breech? And it's just there was no reason for me to actually think that. It was just like I couldn't quite figure out what was
Speaker 2
the Who doesn't play with those ideas?
Speaker 3
Yeah. So that was the only time, and I was like, but what if the baby like, I was, like, for a second entertaining, like, an ultrasound, but I was like, no. I kinda gonna do that. And then I thought, okay. What if the outcome is that the baby is rich, what changes about my decisions? And nothing nothing would change. So then I decided I don't need that. And then, yeah, I got over that pretty quickly.
Speaker 2
I guess the argument for it would be even though it's nonsensical because babies could flip back, but it would give you a sense of control in your ability to prepare for that particular presentation. You know what I mean?
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. But, like those.
Speaker 2
It still doesn't make any sense because a thirty six week presentation is literally meaningless to what's gonna happen Yeah. Five weeks later.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. I had decided that I it actually may be better if it was a surprise, though.
Speaker 4
So
Speaker 2
Mhmm. Yeah. That's a good point. Right? I mean, ultrasound is all about the illusion of control.
Speaker 3
Yeah.
Speaker 2
And so to opt out of that or to not opt into it, you know, is to contend. It it it means to grapple with our own desire for control and to face the truth.
Speaker 3
Mhmm. Mhmm.
Speaker 2
Which is that we don't have it.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So then comes, I'm I'm around, yeah, thirty nine weeks in some days. And I, woke up one early, like, really early one morning, and I sneak out of the bedroom where my daughter and my husband are sleeping. And I'm, like, just chilling on the couch. Like, what was that? It was, like, the faintest little something. And I'm like, was that what I think it is? And at this point, I hadn't felt anything. Didn't get any, like, practice sensations, nothing beforehand. So it was my very first sign of anything. And then sure enough, throughout that day, they just kept building, and they were still very light. We went to my friend's house. We took a little walk on the beach with the kids. I had come home, like, in the afternoon. I was kinda, like, getting dinner ready, playing with my daughter. Just kinda feeling them, but they were gradually building for sure. And then after dinner, my daughter goes to bed. Me and my husband are sitting on the couch, and I'm like, yeah. I think I think, like, something's happening. And it's funny because it was the same trajectory as my daughter's, like, same timeline. And, he's like, okay. Like, I'm gonna get a few things, like, sorted. He's like, how are you feeling? And I'll never forget when he asked this question because I'm like, well, I feel excited, but I also feel like I'm about to do Ayahuasca or DMT or something. Yeah. It's that anticipation. And I told him, like, I didn't have this with Irie with her, you know, with early labor with her because I didn't know what to expect. And I didn't have this the first time I did mushrooms because I didn't know what to expect. But, like, every subsequent time, it's like, you know, it's coming. So there's this, like, buildup. Right? And I'm like, I feel like I'm about to go on a big journey. So then things progress throughout the night. And around ten o'clock is the point where I'm like, can't be doing other things and need to go inward and focus on my breath. And I sent my husband to bed. Hopefully, he could get some sleep. And then I ended up waking him up not too long after. He started a fire. The evenings were still getting, like, a little chilly at this point, so he got a fire going. And for the next, like, hours, like, I don't know, maybe, like, four hours, I was in it. Like, I was fully in it. Like, this birth humbled me. This birth was way more intense than my first, which I was not expecting at all. But I was also very aware that birth is wild. It is spontaneous. It's unpredictable in a sense, but also very straightforward and simple, as Yolanda likes to say. But yeah. So this birth was wild. I was I was wild. I was very loud. My daughter had woken up, so she joined us. I was just flopping around all over the floor. The intensity that I was feeling in my pelvis was insane. I was, like, opening, like, just it was very painful. I had had a very painful birth. There's no way around that, I guess, for me. And I was in the bath for a bit, and my waters were intact still. And I was begging for them to break because I was like, I know I'll get relief if my waters break. And, sure enough, I was sitting on the toilet, and finally, they burst open, which I didn't have that experience with my first birth. So that was interesting. And then about I went back into the living room, and then I got on, like, a one knee on the ground, one leg out to the side. And, I started pushing, and I was actively pushing because I was like, I want him to come. Or I didn't know
Speaker 2
Are you are you doing that?
Speaker 3
I was doing it. I was doing it.
Speaker 2
No annoying questions, though, this time?
Speaker 3
No. Oh my gosh. My husband is, like, amazing. He's the best birth keeper ever. Like, not giving in to my, like, oh, poor me at all. Just being so supportive, so attentive, such a great space holder. He was amazing. And we're trying to film a lot of this too. My husband makes, videos for a living and for a hobby. So we're trying to, like, put together a video. So he's got, like, cameras going, but he's, like, turning them off and on because, like, he's not running for eight hours. So, I'm like, he's coming, and the camera's not on. The camera's not on. We didn't know this.
Speaker 2
We didn't
Speaker 3
know this at the time. So, so, anyway, he oh, his head was, like, really close. I'm, like, pulling on some hair, and wondering, like, what is that? Is that hair? Ask my husband if he if he can see. He can't see anything. He's bore he's yeah. He comes. Like, his head comes, and, I can feel myself kinda tearing a little bit. So I'm like, okay, Jess. Back off of it. Like, hang tight. Take a breath, and then he just shoots right out. I pull him up onto my chest, and then I realized his cord is wrapped around the back of his neck, like, just draped. So I pull it off, have him on my chest, and I'm just, like, bawling. So happy to see him. My husband's calling my daughter who's now in in the other room to come. She had fallen asleep. So then he goes and grabs her. Before he goes and grabs her, I look between, his legs, and I'm like, it's a boy. Just start crying. And then this is like, it's a boy. And my, my daughter comes, so she's, like, half asleep. I'm like, there's now a baby here. Yeah. So amazing. So amazing.
Speaker 2
I
Speaker 3
get, like, as comfortable as I can on the floor and just chill there for a bit. And then, making note of the time kind of because, just wanted to be aware of the time, for his birth, but then also just for the placenta. And about half an hour later, I my husband puts a bowl under, and placenta just plops right out. It was really easy. I was really grateful for that, that it just came right out. We call my very best friend who I had actually planned on calling to come to the birth, but that didn't happen. There was just no time where I wanted to invite another
Speaker 2
I feel you.
Speaker 3
Into it.
Speaker 2
We have we have very similar birth stories.
Speaker 3
We do. And it's funny because I listened to your story. Your birth story came out, like, two or three days after my son was born Oh, how funny. On a podcast. And I'm, like, in my postpartum bed listening to your story, and I'm like, woah. It's the same. It's the same.
Speaker 2
It sounds super similar.
Speaker 3
Yeah. So, so, yeah, my friend comes after the placenta. We delivered the placenta. I call her, and she comes and just takes such good care of us. She's, like, giving me a little sponge bath and, like, just being so yeah. She's amazing. And, yeah, that was that was it. And then we were in a little our little bubble of love, and it was beautiful, and it was perfect. And it was definitely how it was supposed to be. You know? And it was it was such a nice family birth.
Speaker 2
Mhmm. Simple and sweet.
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2
Birthing without gnats. Just as rebirth.
Speaker 3
It's so funny. Oh my gosh. Yeah.
Speaker 2
It's true. I love it. I love it. So many women have, you know, equated Ayahuasca to free birth.
Speaker 3
Oh, man.
Speaker 2
You know?
Speaker 3
It is.
Speaker 2
Have you not?
Speaker 3
Yeah. Yeah. For sure.
Speaker 2
Anything else you wanna say before we wrap?
Speaker 3
Yeah. I guess I can say that I, so my son is four months old now. So I'm not currently attending births, But I am starting to get back into the headspace of of work and stuff, so I'm gonna be opening up some coaching spaces for for women, which you can find on my website. So yeah.
Speaker 2
Yeah. Say your website?
Speaker 3
Oh, yeah. So it's birth wisdom within dot com. And on Instagram, it's birth wisdom within.
Speaker 2
Perfect. Love it. Thank you so much.
Speaker 3
Thank you. To hear. Thanks, Emilee.
Speaker 2
I hope you enjoyed the show today. You can support this podcast by donating to it on free birth society dot com and leaving an awesome review on whatever platform you listen on. The more reviews, the more visibility the show gets, so let's spread the word of Sovereign Birth. We've always got a lot going on at Free Birth Society, and you can find out about all of it at free birth society dot com, at free birth society on Instagram, and opt in to my newsletter below in the show notes. We offer courses on free birth, authentic midwifery, and the blood mysteries, as well as one on one coaching, in person retreats, and, of course, our annual women's festival. Our exclusive vetted private membership is definitely something to check out if you're looking for a community of wise sisters. Together, we rise. We must speak our stories, claim our lives, and support one another. This is the living revolution, and I am so grateful to be in it with all of you. I'll leave you with our epic Free Birth Society theme song, Wild Woman by Aruba Red.
Speaker 4
I honor you for the wisdom you held, the ancient traditions of plant medicine and womb magic. I feel the spirit of the ancestors as I place my hands upon my belly. This sacred portal will be honored, eons upon light beams of survival, withstanding, the eradication of our power by design. I will not allow the separation of our young to be forced upon me. My sisters will no longer birth in captivity. The picket line redefined from burning our wild women to paralyzing us and drugging our babes. Strapped down in a clinical white bed, drying up the milk from our breasts, keep your needles. My family will never again be doomed to chase those dragons or your poison. We reject your fear. We choose love. Everything with intention. Death, ascension. I will fly and bring her back from the star. Wild woman, she still lives inside. Wild woman, from you, I will not hide. They could not bend
